Tank Gear's Value for the Future.

[Kaurie]

I don't understand why we even have to compete for class damage ratios since this is ultimately a co-operative game. You're not even supposed to be fighting your team mates for whoever has the bigger sword(d*ck).

Nerfing tank contribution to miniscule amounts ultimately just hurts everyone. I mean, whats the point? Just so the DPS can be the actual players in the fight and tanks and healers are reduced to sidekicks whom are only there to glorify the DPS classes?
I don't understand why we can't even have anything above half of what a DPS can do. Something considerably significant.

Like if you were a party of four adventurers going up against a fearsome dragon of ultimate death and you(the edgy thief with 1000 knives of dark bloodshed) want your Knight(a warrior armed to the friggin teeth for BATTLE) to wield a pool noodle because his sword detracts from your narutoxsasukexichigo awesomeness.

I am not sure if I convey myself appropriately, but I am not competing for the highest number. I mean, I am always trying to maximize my potential and my static mates and I kid around about these things, but yes we work as a team. That does not mean that I promote a game system that is as imbalanced as it is right now. To be honest, I find your argument to be rather offensive, as if the only reason why I would possibly want the game to be balanced is because of some sense of not feeling adequate.

My stance has nothing to do with feelings of self inadequacy and fully to do with wanting to play a game that is balanced. That said, I am sorry that my proposal of nerfing WAR damage is such a threat to your primary.

Personally, I play this game in large part due to the strict trinity. If I did not want a trinity, I'd play Guild Wars 2, because outside of that, it's a superior game. The combat is much more fluid, the trait system is fun and involved, the open world content is more fun and engaging, the pvp is vastly better and so on. Guild Wars 2 fails because their end game pve is reduced to throwing out as much DPS as you can and revolves little around actual team work and coordination (in comparison to this game).

[Instrumentality]

That makes sense, and I appreciate your input on it. I was just throwing out numbers and didn't calculate anything. It was more to give an order in terms of DPS and a comparative value between DPS and tanks. If people are concerned over the precision, I can edit my original post.

Yeah it' just that situational utility would never close that kind of gap. It almost feels criminal taking bards/machinist even now when at the 75th percentile of play on fflogs they're only 13% behind monks. Another 7% would be real bad.

[Twilite]

BLM can't move or he drops Enochian.

I think you mean Astral Fire III which is the only issue now.

[Alahra]

Yeah it' just that situational utility would never close that kind of gap. It almost feels criminal taking bards/machinist even now when at the 75th percentile of play on fflogs they're only 13% behind monks. Another 7% would be real bad.

I think BRD/MCH need a DPS boost in general as is. If they still had all their mobility from ARR I don't know that I'd feel that way, but they're far more hindered by mechanics than they used to be, which makes me really hate getting them even in simple DF content like dungeons, where the utility they bring is of relatively low value (except for Foe's Requiem, if the other DPS happens to be a caster).

The two support DPS are actually part of why it feels as though tank damage in general is a bit too high to me, actually. Either lowering tank damage a bit (which the accessory change is likely to do) or boosting BRD/MCH some would solve that.

[Nektulos-Tuor]

Got tired of people in the tank forums telling you your ideas were wrongheaded?

Also no, this still never needs to happen. Hope this helps!

If I'm wrong, and my ideas are pig-headed. Why are they 13 pages?

[Instrumentality]

Personally, I play this game in large part due to the strict trinity. If I did not want a trinity, I'd play Guild Wars 2, because outside of that, it's a superior game. The combat is much more fluid, the trait system is fun and involved, the open world content is more fun and engaging, the pvp is vastly better and so on. Guild Wars 2 fails because their end game pve is reduced to throwing out as much DPS as you can and revolves little around actual team work and coordination (in comparison to this game).

How does tanks doing "large" amounts of damage harm the trinity? (large in comparison to...what, healers?)

Tanks at the absolute top tier of play aren't out damaging dps, and that remains true for every level of play you care to examine through every percentile examinable on fflogs.

Why does tanks even being close matter?

If I'm wrong, and my ideas are pig-headed. Why are they 13 pages?

There are only four pages for me, and I haven't seen many people agreeing with you (at all, anywhere).

Still hiding your tank character (that doesn't even have 210 jewelry on it), I guess?

[Alahra]

Why does tanks even being close matter?

Because if they get too close, they might start replacing DPS in parties becasue of their increased survivability (and in the case of WARs, utility). You could reasonably make the same argument regarding 2.0 BRDs—why did it matter if their DPS was close to MNK/DRG DPS? It mattered because BRDs (and casters) were generally more favored in party setups than melee DPS.

I'm not saying we're at that point yet, but the potential for something like that to occur is there if tank DPS were to scale too well in the future.

[Kaurie]

How does tanks doing "large" amounts of damage harm the trinity? (large in comparison to...what, healers?)

Tanks at the absolute top tier of play aren't out damaging dps, and that remains true for every level of play you care to examine through every percentile examinable on fflogs.

Why does tanks even being close matter?
?

They are out DPSing certain DPS jobs in certain fights (i.e. definitely beating BRD/MCH in Ravana EX for example) Granted, mostly it is just very close. Close in the way that a SMN is to a DRG on Manipulator, or a NIN is to a MNK on living liquid.

Doing 85% of the damage of the top DPS harms the trinity, imo.

Regardless, I honestly don't care to argue this any further. We clearly have different opinions and neither one of ours is going to change anything.

[Nektulos-Tuor]

They are out DPSing certain DPS jobs in certain fights (i.e. definitely beating BRD/MCH in Ravana EX for example) Granted, mostly it is just very close. Close in the way that a SMN is to a DRG on Manipulator, or a NIN is to a MNK on living liquid.

Doing 85% of the damage of the top DPS harms the trinity, imo.

Regardless, I honestly don't care to argue this any further. We clearly have different opinions and neither one of ours is going to change anything.

If tanks do very little damage, it also harms Trinity. =3

[Kaze3434]

If I'm wrong, and my ideas are pig-headed. Why are they 13 pages?

people talking about why you are wrong doesnt mean you are right.