If tank damage is now based on VIT, why do healers still have Cleric Stance?

[Andrea]

I seriously doubt that SE designed cleric stance to enable 'stance dancing' in dungeon instances.

I also seriously doubt that SE gave us so many DPS spells to 'solo' content.

If SE didn't expect people to use cleric stance to stance dance in dungeons and do DPS then they are without a doubt the dumbest developers ever.

Edit: can already tell this thread is going to turn into another - Healers should DPS/ Healers shouldn't do DPS.

[DPZ2]

I also seriously doubt that SE gave us so many DPS spells to 'solo' content.

If SE didn't expect people to use cleric stance to stance dance in dungeons and do DPS then they are without a doubt the dumbest developers ever.

Ummmm.. the entire 1-60 questing experience is one huge set of DPS tests. Without DPS spells, you could not level. Period. Of course they gave CNJ/WHM damage spells for this solo content.

That clever players found a use for this stance in dungeon instances was not intentional, but it is what it is. I have no opinion in the quarrel about its use.

[Launched]

Ummmm.. the entire 1-60 questing experience is one huge set of DPS tests. Without DPS spells, you could not level. Period. Of course they gave CNJ/WHM damage spells for this solo content.

That clever players found a use for this stance in dungeon instances was not intentional, but it is what it is. I have no opinion in the quarrel about its use.

There are no high DPS checks in story content. If SE didn't intend healers to do good DPS, they would have stopped at Stone and just let them slowly kill anything while healing themselves. The fact that healer got super strong aoe spells like Holy, Aero III, Assize, Gravity, Bane etc., along with more DPS skills after 50 and Cleric Stance being usable in combat clearly shows that healers were intended to be able to contribute significant DPS in both solo and group content. SE might not absolutely require healer DPS to clear content, but healers were definitely intended to be able to contribute a lot in dungeons if you'd just look at the skills.

[UBERHAXED]

There are no high DPS checks in story content. If SE didn't intend healers to do good DPS, they would have stopped at Stone and just let them slowly kill anything while healing themselves. The fact that healer got super strong aoe spells like Holy, Aero III, Assize, Gravity, Bane etc., along with more DPS skills after 50 and Cleric Stance being usable in combat clearly shows that healers were intended to be able to contribute significant DPS in both solo and group content. SE might not absolutely require healer DPS to clear content, but healers were definitely intended to be able to contribute a lot in dungeons if you'd just look at the skills.

Methinks you have not tried killing mobs above level 30 just using stone 1 and heals. You are likely to run out of mp before the thing dies. And that's just trash mobs in the open. The instances are much harder (i.e. intended for DPS classes to no breeze through pressing one button). Also might be worth nothing that Bane is not a healer skill, it happened to be there not to waste a job slot for summoner (but they did so anyway with tri-bind (then called tri-disaster), sigh...). There are instances in the story where you need to use AoE any way, so scholar being out of luck would be bad.

[Andrea]

Methinks you have not tried killing mobs above level 30 just using stone 1 and heals. You are likely to run out of mp before the thing dies. And that's just trash mobs in the open. The instances are much harder (i.e. intended for DPS classes to no breeze through pressing one button). Also might be worth nothing that Bane is not a healer skill, it happened to be there not to waste a job slot for summoner (but they did so anyway with tri-bind (then called tri-disaster), sigh...). There are instances in the story where you need to use AoE any way, so scholar being out of luck would be bad.

WHM has 8 dps skills, SCH 10. Why do they need so many DPS skills if they were never intended to do DPS in duties? Surely half of that would have been enough and then they could of given us more spells that would have helped in duties? The place where 99% of this game takes place?

[UBERHAXED]

WHM has 8 dps skills, SCH 10. Why do they need so many DPS skills if they were never intended to do DPS in duties? Surely half of that would have been enough and then they could of given us more spells that would have helped in duties? The place where 99% of this game takes place?

Methinks either you quoted the wrong person or have poor reading comprehension skills.

[Andrea]

quoted the wrong person

you would be correct

[Critical-Limit]

Ummmm.. the entire 1-60 questing experience is one huge set of DPS tests. Without DPS spells, you could not level. Period. Of course they gave CNJ/WHM damage spells for this solo content.

That clever players found a use for this stance in dungeon instances was not intentional, but it is what it is. I have no opinion in the quarrel about its use.

more like those solo 1-60 fights had DPS checks. to teach you to DPS for groups.

How is it fair that EVERY OTHER JOB's abilities are DIRECTLY useful for the group. But they waste half of Healing jobs abilities on DPS moves "only" so you can beat story?

that's being short sighted sorry.

DPS from healers is a factor the developers take into account for content outside of solo 1-60 instances.

[Lexia]

DPS from healers is a factor the developers take into account for content outside of solo 1-60 instances.

Actually that not true, Yoshi-p has said they don't count healer dps when tuning a fight. It been brought up in like every thread made about if healers have to dps or not.

[Odett]

Ummmm.. the entire 1-60 questing experience is one huge set of DPS tests. Without DPS spells, you could not level. Period. Of course they gave CNJ/WHM damage spells for this solo content.

That clever players found a use for this stance in dungeon instances was not intentional, but it is what it is. I have no opinion in the quarrel about its use.

Or maybe every healer realized that they had a LOT of downtime when queuing into their first dungeon, and a few thought "hm, it sure is ineffective of me to stand here and do nothing for more than 50% of a fight's length", while others ignored half their skills and took it upon themselves to spam Cure whenever their tank fell below 100% HP, patting themselves on the back for doing an extremely superfluous job. Cleric stance is not blocked out during a dungeon, and neither are any of your offensive spells (which make up roughly half of your skills), because this game was not designed with healers full-time healing in mind, and leveling a healer through dungeons should make that blatantly clear.

Anyway, to TC: It's not a double standard because right now, a healer can have their cake and eat it too. Their main primary stat, MND, increases their healing potency, and they have a skill that changes their MND rating with their INT rating, letting them use offensive spells at their full strength, meaning that they do not have to compromise between healing potency and offensive spell potency when gearing up. Tanks can only equip one STR or VIT accessory in the same slot, meaning they have to balance out how much HP their are comfortable with having for the content at hand, against how much strength they want in order to increase their damage, self heals, and drop their reliance on their agro combo if they are a DRK; no other role in this game has to make such a decision.