I got to give you people credit.

[FunkyBunch]

Snippy snip

I think we're in agreement. I never said a bad DPS doesn't hinder tanks. I'm just saying bad tanks are the only variable in my run speeds.
An extra good DPS when the tank is taking 6 pulls to get through an area instead of 2 doesn't make a big difference.
Yes, I realize there are bad DPS, I'm just saying that there are bad tanks and if I have a slow run it's more to do with a bad tank than anything else.

[Jim_Berry]

Hard content is even worse. Most wipes should be from boss mechanics. Instead, they are widely caused by either (1) Dps standing in so much stupid that they die and the healers have to waste time and mana raising them, or (2) not meeting Dps checks and wiping the whole group. Given that Dps rotations are all well documented and on a pretty tight leash (sometimes right down to the second for which buffs should be applied at what times), this is mind blowing.

Not all. I'll give you an example with NIN. We have Suiton, Hide, and Trick Attack. Trick Attack "Can only be executed when under the effect of Hide". You'd be surprised that some NINs wouldn't use Trick Attack in battle because they can't use Hide while engaged. They have to be informed that Suiton triggers Trick Attack. The game doesn't tell us that. Heck, when I first started NIN, I thought Suiton gave me added water damage until I kept seeing Trick Attack glowing.

So, not all abilites are documented in the tooltips.

[Starbirth]

When I compared ff14's dps classes to other mmos I noticed many of them, especially melee classes, have the difficulty of their rotations inflated.

In all honesty I would prefer them to remove positionals and make more mechanically complex fights.

...or better yet have a job focus on one position like monk/ninja for back and dragoon for side.

you know what? screw it. All tank abilities have halved potency if not done in the front.

[Valkyrie-Amber]

would be nice if complex mechanical stuff were programmable for the ps3 but its not so till they drop support things will remain muscle memory....

[AskaRay]

Not all. I'll give you an example with NIN. We have Suiton, Hide, and Trick Attack. Trick Attack "Can only be executed when under the effect of Hide". You'd be surprised that some NINs wouldn't use Trick Attack in battle because they can't use Hide while engaged. They have to be informed that Suiton triggers Trick Attack. The game doesn't tell us that. Heck, when I first started NIN, I thought Suiton gave me added water damage until I kept seeing Trick Attack glowing.

So, not all abilites are documented in the tooltips.

Doesn't the Suiton effect tooltip say you can use Hide abilities when it's active?

[Waliel]

Doesn't the Suiton effect tooltip say you can use Hide abilities when it's active?

Can't say about the buff tooltip, but it should definitely read on the skill itself.

[Jim_Berry]

When I compared ff14's dps classes to other mmos I noticed many of them, especially melee classes, have the difficulty of their rotations inflated.

In all honesty I would prefer them to remove positionals and make more mechanically complex fights.

...or better yet have a job focus on one position like monk/ninja for back and dragoon for side.

you know what? screw it. All tank abilities have halved potency if not done in the front.

I agree!

Also, the thing that bothers me is people's expectations on Faust. People shouted at me for stepping on Faust's flank. I told them it was for higher potency for Armor Crush. They yelled say to stay behind him at all times. Then, we had a MNK getting yelled at for the same thing. When Faust died after three wipes, we won because me, the DRG, and the MNK went back to doing positionals.

Now, there's another argument there; the tank said if we can't kill Faust without positionals, we suck as DPS. The MNK said, "lets see u tank faust without your cds". We never got to fight Oppressor because the MNK and WAR argued for 20 minutes, then the SCH bailed, followed slowly by everyone else.

[Jim_Berry]

Doesn't the Suiton effect tooltip say you can use Hide abilities when it's active?

This is the description IN GAME.:

Range: 15y Radius: 0y
Cast: Instant Recast: 20s

Delivers water damage with a potency of 180.
Additional Effect: Grants the caster Suiton.
Duration: 10s
Mudra Combinations: Ten->Chi->Jin or Chi->Ten->Jin

Affinity: NIN

[Ironos]

This is the description IN GAME.:

If you mouseover the actual buff of Suiton, given by using the Suiton Ninjutsu, it says something along the lines of your body being veiled in light bending water, enabling actions that normally require the Hidden status.

I do agree that it should state that on the tooltip of Suiton itself, but it is there, just out of the way placement.

[Jim_Berry]

If you mouseover the actual buff of Suiton, given by using the Suiton Ninjutsu, it says something along the lines of your body being veiled in light bending water, enabling actions that normally require the Hidden status.

I do agree that it should state that on the tooltip of Suiton itself, but it is there, just out of the way placement.

"Body is enveloped in a light-bending veil of water, allowing use of actions normally requiring the Hidden status."

Some folks will question the meaning behind "Hidden status", but Februs said that the descriptions are well documented and are on a tight leash. If that's the case, then Suiton would actually tell us about it's hidden effect, not make us guess it.