Next Relic: make use of Extreme trails

[Arashmin]

XI relics weren't for casuals, but they had lasting value. There's a huge difference in doing a grind once and doing that same grind, from what YoshiP seems to intend, to be a yearly one.

[Kosmos992k]

XI relics weren't for casuals, but they had lasting value. There's a huge difference in doing a grind once and doing that same grind, from what YoshiP seems to intend, to be a yearly one.

Yes, but this isn't FFXIV, it's a painfully vertical progression game, so the relic here is not a lasting thing except for players behind the curve or as glamour. Some say the relics in FFXIV are for the XI players, except they can't ever be what relics were in XI. In FFXIV relics are catch up weapons for players who have the time and/or mind set to handle a grind, they are not meant to keep pace with raiding weapons. Gating relic upgrades behind more difficult content disenfranchises a great many players. That's just plain bad business.

[Lambdafish]

XI relics weren't for casuals, but they had lasting value. There's a huge difference in doing a grind once and doing that same grind, from what YoshiP seems to intend, to be a yearly one.

I never said that the quests were designed well, and I don't believe I mentioned the XI weapons themselves (other than the offhand joke). The grind IS supposed to mimic the effort that the XI relic took (though toned down to meet the standard of this game), but the weapons themselves are disappointments considering that fact.

So yeah, the relics are designed in their current state because XI players asked for grindy content, and for some reason, the notion that its for casuals has cropped up and makes no sense, when from the outset, the task looks pretty hardcore.

Which step 2 does a fine job of.

I have a love hate relationship with step 2. I think its a great step for having me personally visit old content and have a change of pace, but it fails in the fact that you only need to do the dungeon once, and it can be done unsynced. What this means is that very few people are still in PF and everyone is doing it premade and unsynced, which while fun, does defeat the point.

[Kosmos992k]

So yeah, the relics are designed in their current state because XI players asked for grindy content, and for some reason, the notion that its for casuals has cropped up and makes no sense, when from the outset, the task looks pretty hardcore.

I'm sorry, I think you're wrong about that. I don't have the quote to hand, but Yoshi-P specifically described the relic upgrade as an alternate path to progress to better weapons for players who did not partake of the raid and extreme content. I think this is something he's discussed multiple times in that context. I don't remember him mentioning anything about it being there for former XI players demanding grindy content, that may be a conclusion of your own.