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  1. #301
    Player
    Sicno's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    654
    Character
    Sandra Dalvia
    World
    Adamantoise
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 90
    And what about the selfish diva dps who think their stacks or enochian are the most important thing in the entire dungeon and if you don't make them happy they start pulling on their own?
    (9)
    Naoki Yoshida:
    ...Similarly, these older MMOs also had a system where your house would break down if you didn’t log in after a while in order to have you continue your subscription, but this is a thing of the past and we won't have any system like that.
    Source: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/113554 at 1:14:22

  2. #302
    Player
    MicahZerrshia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    2,286
    Character
    Nadja Zielle
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Arcanist Lv 100
    You obviously don't play anything who have stacks to worry about.

    So so so many tanks stand there, full tp, full mp, full hp and twiddle their thumbs til your stacks wear off for no reason then complain that dps is lacking....
    (3)

  3. #303
    Player
    Eothas's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    161
    Character
    Xander Wolf
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Sage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Archaell View Post
    but with the (healer) queues getting longer, it might not be good idea to annoy the tank.
    I play both (healz and tank), queues are about the same, the Primadonna Diva tank card will never work against me.

    It's not a good idea to annoy ANYONE. Also, I can finish ex roulette without a tank if really necessary.
    (2)

  4. #304
    Player
    IndigoHawk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    276
    Character
    Yslera Ravshana
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 60
    Quote Originally Posted by Shai View Post
    ... Tanks are selfish divas who think the dungeon runs around them and everyone should cater to them or they'll just drop and requeue faster than an average DPS would without a penalty.
    Dungeons revolve around tanks, because there's a tank shortage. Many people don't want the responsibility to tank or are driven from it by people with bad attitudes. Tanks deserve slack because they're doing a role few people want to do.

    Also, you're good enough that you don't even need tanks, so best practices don't apply to you. However, the best practice for duty finder is let the tank lead, pull, and don't push faster than they can or want to go. That has the highest chance of success and will result in the fastest dungeons on average by reducing wipes and time spent arguing.

    Only a selfish diva would push tanks too fast and drive them from the role and make queues longer for everyone.
    (16)

  5. #305
    Player
    Archaell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    1,049
    Character
    Arch Idealist
    World
    Alpha
    Main Class
    Blacksmith Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Eothas View Post
    I play both (healz and tank), queues are about the same, the Primadonna Diva tank card will never work against me.

    It's not a good idea to annoy ANYONE. Also, I can finish ex roulette without a tank if really necessary.
    That's good point. The card does not work if you are willing to discard it even at price of getting kicked.

    I do my stuff mostly on WHM and it seems that healer ranks are increasing - at least on Chaos.
    (0)

  6. #306
    Player
    Sicno's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    654
    Character
    Sandra Dalvia
    World
    Adamantoise
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by MicahZerrshia View Post
    You obviously don't play anything who have stacks to worry about.

    So so so many tanks stand there, full tp, full mp, full hp and twiddle their thumbs til your stacks wear off for no reason then complain that dps is lacking....
    Hi, lvl 60 MNK here \o and while it's bad to lose GL it's not the end of the world either.

    Edit: also have you thought that maybe that tank is not there just thinking about the immortality of the crab but instead may be thinking of how to do the next pull or checking his inventory or checking other players or waiting for a patrolling enemy to reach a certain spot?
    (12)
    Last edited by Sicno; 11-10-2015 at 05:01 PM.
    Naoki Yoshida:
    ...Similarly, these older MMOs also had a system where your house would break down if you didn’t log in after a while in order to have you continue your subscription, but this is a thing of the past and we won't have any system like that.
    Source: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/113554 at 1:14:22

  7. #307
    Player
    Noxifer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    1,177
    Character
    C'alih Tia
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Skivvy View Post
    I hope there was some basic communication between the party and the archer before you just let him die. :3
    There was -- he was repeatedly asked to let the tank do the pulling. Initially politely, then more and more directly each time he did it. We just got fed up with him not listening.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shai View Post
    So many dungeons (Expert Roulette) that the tank has just wandered AFK for ten minutes - cause hey he didn't wait 15-45 minutes to join the queue, so it's not like he couldn't have gotten a drink or taken a crap beforehand with all that extra time - and I just tell the DPS to pull. I can clear everything up to the boss of ANY dungeon without a tank. Hell, when queue as a full party, we often don't even bring a tank, and I'm not talking about Copperbell, but Neverreap (sure this doesn't work for all of them).
    There's a difference between pulling for someone who is clearly not there (and dealing with those mobs while waiting for that someone to come back and start doing their job again), and pulling for someone who IS there and is doing their job -- just not at the pace you prefer. Like I've mentioned before, I tend to go with the "you pull it; you tank it" mindset, at least if said pulling is intentional. I mean, mistakes happen, and sometimes a dps accidentally moves into a wandering mob's field of vision. And in those cases I have no issues taking aggro off of them. But when healers or dps intentionally pull in more mobs into a pack than I had anticipated, I just don't like it. And sure, if you pull a mob or two and actually tank them yourself, that's fine, but it still adds to my stress levels as a tank ^^;

    Back when I was a young and insecure tank (shortly after the beta, in other words), it happened too many times in the first four dungeons. Still remember the time in Halatali when the healer pulled in all three of the wandering bombs when I'd pulled the dullahan-wannabe and the three imps back. Being "a good tank" (no, not in the skill sense, but in the "gotta save the squishies!" sense), I flashed and all that, and was subsequently blown up when overlapping self-destructs meant I had no chance of getting out of all of them in time. Then the healer proceeded to blame me for dying, commenting that it's an "easy pull". No, it's not. Not when you panic because too many mobs are pulled into the fight. Not when none of the dps actually have any AoE capabilities. And not when you're still learning the game.
    If I'd known then what I do now, I would have let the healer deal with the bombs all on their own and just continued focusing on the mobs I'd pulled, but meh.

    Sure, dps and healers have more AoE capabilities at 50+ (duh), and healers have more ohshit buttons. But the core behaviour of deciding for me what I'm comfortable pulling is still just as rude. Especially when it's done at the very first pull (like that first island in Neverreap). Due to bad experiences in the gearing-up rush just before Alex Normal was released, I never went into Ex roulette solo. Unless I had at least a healer I knew (preferrably one or two dps in addition to that), I just didn't do it. *shrugs*
    (6)

  8. #308
    Player
    XiXiQ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    809
    Character
    Xixi Eclipse
    World
    Ravana
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Sicno View Post
    And what about the selfish diva dps who think their stacks or enochian are the most important thing in the entire dungeon and if you don't make them happy they start pulling on their own?
    the new level 60 stuff has made this an issue in some cases. I've not noticed it much with bard, but with blm and mch tanking does matter more. blm doesn't have the luxury of using enochian every trash pull, and small pulls of only 2-3 is a waste of their dps. Mch needs to place turrets depending on the pull, and I see plenty of tanks pulling mobs out of their aoe range anyway. I'm not much of a fan of any of the level 60 stuff, so I don't blame the tanks, it's just more crap they shouldn't be dealing with.
    (1)

  9. #309
    Player
    Shai's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Hawaii
    Posts
    714
    Character
    Shai Hulud
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 60
    Quote Originally Posted by IndigoHawk View Post
    Dungeons revolve around tanks, because there's a tank shortage. Many people don't want the responsibility to tank or are driven from it by people with bad attitudes. Tanks deserve slack because they're doing a role few people want to do.

    Also, you're good enough that you don't even need tanks, so best practices don't apply to you. However, the best practice for duty finder is let the tank lead, pull, and don't push faster than they can or want to go. That has the highest chance of success and will result in the fastest dungeons on average by reducing wipes and time spent arguing.

    Only a selfish diva would push tanks too fast and drive them from the role and make queues longer for everyone.
    No, they really don't. This is the "diva" attitude I'm talking about. Tanks shouldn't get special treatment (cut slack).

    Man, when a tank joins up and says "Hey, I never ran this dungeon before - you guys mind if I do simple pulls just to get the hang of it?" Sure, man. Go for it. Very few people care about that. All I ever cared about at all in this thread is TANKS WHO WASTE MY DAMN TIME like they got all the time in the world. I'm not sitting there demanding speed runs, but I am saying there's a threshold for when a tank isn't doing his job, and the party can call him out on it by pulling for him while he stands there diddling around not doing his job (pulling).
    (1)

  10. #310
    Player
    Evangela's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    グリダニア
    Posts
    4,361
    Character
    Evangela Monterossa
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Ninja Lv 90
    It's so funny how tank players still think that other roles have to wait very long to get in a duty.
    (1)

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