Suggestion about Cleric Stance

[BroodingFicus]

My one complaint with cleric is how finicky it can seem. I can't tell you how many times I'll hit it and due to some lag or who knows what it doesn't seem to turn off. So I hit it again and magically I pop out and right back in and get stuck waiting to be able to heal. So I never use it unless I'm 100% the tank is good /and/ benediction is up just in case I was wrong. And that is on trash. On bosses where party wide damage is more likely I almost never touch it. I don't feel like I can put that much faith in it working exactly as it should. It reminds me of Mudra lag when I played ninja. Seeing as its taking up a spot for WHM that could be used for something else I'd be ok with them taking it away.

[Normalizer]

Yes it does. With the current attitude of the community, a lot of new players I know (some of them that I invited personally) feel discouraged to try and DPS because they could let the tank die.
And let's stop calling people 'bad', geez.

If they want to try they can always dps without stance dancing, even if it probably doesn't worth anything. Or just thinking in your head and practice not casting any heal in every 5 sec interval :P More of the time i feel like ppl sometimes just want an excuse for not trying though :| And let face it, with the current gear now your tank don't die that fast even on big pull unless your tank forgets his CDs.

[Fevelle]

If they want to try they can always dps without stance dancing, even if it probably doesn't worth anything. Or just thinking in your head and practice not casting any heal in every 5 sec interval :P More of the time i feel like ppl sometimes just want an excuse for not trying though :| And let face it, with the current gear now your tank don't die that fast even on big pull unless your tank forgets his CDs.

The gear doesn't matter, really. Content need to be balanced to the minimum ilv for it, not for overgeared people. Lack of confidence is no 'excuse', given the toxicity of the players on DF. Also, Cleric is eating up one WHM ability slot, so it's better gone than in.

I meant the tank gear not the healer gear. Tank won't die that fast.

Also I see you keep saying how toxic the ppl on DF is... If they want you not to dps, then just stick to heal, and don't dps, really, you might even get more commends that way. And if they want you dps, even if they die that is their fault for giving you a chance to practise, not yours. Beside, what friends are for then if you can't even give your friend some dungeons run to practice stance dancing :/

Even if SE makes this happen and you don't have to stance dance, I guess we will start seeing thread suggest "Healing spells should add dmg to random mobs" soon enough, sure because what if tank dies while you are mid-cast your dps spell!!!!

/sarcasm, but i'm out of here though.

Edit since I can't post anymore (20 posts rule).

It doesn't matter if you were talking about tank gear, like I said content is balanced having a party with the minimum iLV requirements: all of them, including the tank.

And yes, players tend to be toxic on DF: they often leave because a DPS die, leave because tank couldn't keep aggro on one pull for whatever reason, call people out for having one piece of equipment lower than expected. I lost count of how many times I entered 0/4 progress parties on Brayflox where people left for stupid, pitiful reasons.

If SE makes it happen, you will probably see healers DPS sky rocketing since we will be able to weave attack spells even on healing intensive fights with much more ease, and also new players being less defensive when it comes to DPS as healers. Also a replacement for WHM Cleric Stance to solve our utility problem, and one more free cross-class slot for AST and SCH. It's a win-win situation.

[Normalizer]

...

I meant the tank gear not the healer gear. Tank won't die that fast.

Also I see you keep saying how toxic the ppl on DF is... If they want you not to dps, then just stick to heal, and don't dps, really, you might even get more commends that way. And if they want you dps, even if they die that is their fault for giving you a chance to practise, not yours. Beside, what friends are for then if you can't even give your friend some dungeons run to practice stance dancing :/

Even if SE makes this happen and you don't have to stance dance, I guess we will start seeing thread suggest "Healing spells should add dmg to random mobs" soon enough, sure because what if tank dies while you are mid-cast your dps spell!!!!

/sarcasm, but i'm out of here though.

[Entilper]

Cleric Stance

Pros: In some people's mind it's what makes a good healer, so that's what the skill is for, if I can see someone doing it properly means he/she is a good healer despite of anything else.

Cons: Waste one skill, can imply to mistakes some times in the urge of the moment when someone screw up and you still have to get off it, dps and heals cannot intercalate cuz no healer changes attributes after one spell and waste of time changing it.

If anyone wanna point more pros at this indispensable and really productive healer's skill, I'm at your service.

[Mutemutt]

No thanks. The only thing remotely interesting about healer dps is that you have to give up healing to do it.

Though, to be honest, I rather they move away from healer dps for the light/full party content.

[Rawrz]

CS adds 10% to your base dps. Think about that. Perm 10%. It has a VERY fast animation, so you can use it in that .5 second window after healing better than almost any ability and lastly it has one of the kindest recasts in the game. 5 seconds isn't even a punishment really. Cast swift while you're waiting for it to finish ticking or (lol) stoneskin if you're that screwed. Cleric stance is probably the best skill in this entire game. 400+% dps boost. Why thank you!

[Fevelle]

CS adds 10% to your base dps. Think about that. Perm 10%. It has a VERY fast animation, so you can use it in that .5 second window after healing better than almost any ability and lastly it has one of the kindest recasts in the game. 5 seconds isn't even a punishment really. Cast swift while you're waiting for it to finish ticking or (lol) stoneskin if you're that screwed. Cleric stance is probably the best skill in this entire game. 400+% dps boost. Why thank you!

No, Cleric Stance is the most bloated skill in this game, since healers damage could scale with mind and not having a skill taking up space on WHM's toolkit and other healers cross-class slots would be awesome. The 10% damage wouldn't make difference in the end if you could be able to weave attack spells between heals (insted of Cleric off > Tetragrammaton > Cleric on > Start Casting Aero III, it would be simple Tetragrammaton > Aero III).

No thanks. The only thing remotely interesting about healer dps is that you have to give up healing to do it.

There's nothing interesting to healer DPS, it's just a downtime filler since most fights in the game are flawed doesn't require full-time healing.

[Whiteroom]

Lets take anything that makes you have to pay attention out while we're at it.

Assiez can do max healing and damage potencey as well.

Who needs tank stances? They make great tanking harder, you should get max dps and defense all in one.

Can we just have Heavy Thrust up at all times for DRGs, its hard to remember?

BLMs should get their MP regen while in Astral Fire...

[Mibgestalt]

Initially I imagine Cleric Stance was just to help healers solo. Clearly it's more than that now.

Cleric Stance's healing penalty adds a layer of skill to playing a healer to its fullest. There's almost always DPS to contribute to a group, but this isn't the case with healing. Yes, it's an obstacle to a healer doing DPS, but that's kind of the point. It's the same as MP or cooldowns. It's meant to make the role more challenging by restriction. It doesn't have to parallel a tank's stances, for instance.

Whether you think DPSing should be such a core part of a healer's role in the end-game is a different conversation, but not one necessarily related to Cleric Stance.