Savage Clear rate being lower the Devs expected, good or a bad thing?

[Dante_V]

I think they should keep 2 tiers and make normal more difficult. At least on par with Ravana and such.

[Gilraen]

I think they should keep 2 tiers and make normal more difficult. At least on par with Ravana and such.

What? The clears for Savage aren't as projected so lets make Normal harder? That sounds alot like a 'hardcore raider' argument. The problem isn't Alexander Normal, the problem as was pointed out in this thread is how the 'hardcore raiders' don't want to help anyone they feel is 'not good'. I think Miscreant has the right of it, casual raiders (note the lack of 's there) are getting there, but given the lack of people willing to help them nail down strategies, it's taking a while. "But they can just watch a video, what's the hold up?" Because watching a video isn't learning the fight. It's just watching a video.

[RiceisNice]

What? The clears for Savage aren't as projected so lets make Normal harder? That sounds alot like a 'hardcore raider' argument. The problem isn't Alexander Normal, the problem as was pointed out in this thread is how the 'hardcore raiders' don't want to help anyone they feel is 'not good'. I think Miscreant has the right of it, casual raiders (note the lack of 's there) are getting there, but given the lack of people willing to help them nail down strategies, it's taking a while. "But they can just watch a video, what's the hold up?" Because watching a video isn't learning the fight. It's just watching a video.

Except the majority players aren't hardcore players. Making normal mode "harder" would address part of the problem where the midcore people have no appealing content because normal is too easy, while savage is too difficult. The thread you linked only addresses the state of PF and the lack of people clearing content, not necessarily the lack of people clearing savage (which as someone mentioned, is limited to 1-2 groups per realm on average).

My group is me and 7 other casual-to-midcore raiders. We grouped together with the intention of making a fairly lax approach to raiding with only three 3-hour raid days per week. Not a lot of time to raid, and certianly not enough time for retention when it comes to learning point-specific mecahnics. Having something like "people being more willing to teach" does not resolve the problem that we don't exactly have the people to teach in the first place. And this is applicable to most of the realms that have a relatively weak population (IE, not greg)

[KingOfAbyss]

Except the majority players aren't hardcore players. Making normal mode "harder" would address part of the problem where the midcore people have no appealing content because normal is too easy, while savage is too difficult. The thread you linked only addresses the state of PF and the lack of people clearing content, not necessarily the lack of people clearing savage (which as someone mentioned, is limited to 1-2 groups per realm on average).

My group is me and 7 other casual-to-midcore raiders. We grouped together with the intention of making a fairly lax approach to raiding with only three 3-hour raid days per week. Not a lot of time to raid, and certainly not enough time for retention when it comes to learning point-specific mecahnics. Having something like "people being more willing to teach" does not resolve the problem that we don't exactly have the people to teach in the first place. And this is applicable to most of the realms that have a relatively weak population (IE, not greg)

^ There you have it.

I would love to make a new static with casual and midcore. hardcores are free to join, as long as they don't RQ and willing to teach if needs to.

For me, this is the first time I stick to a game for more than a year. I'm in for the fun, my GF now joins me and she's having fun.

She loves challenges, so I can't wait to have more fun! ^^ FCoB, here we go!

[Miscreant]

I think Miscreant has the right of it, casual raiders (note the lack of 's there) are getting there, but given the lack of people willing to help them nail down strategies, it's taking a while. "But they can just watch a video, what's the hold up?" Because watching a video isn't learning the fight. It's just watching a video.

Sorry I didn't mean to give that impression, but I was more referring to the groups who can't raid frequently enough to be hardcore, which is the larger portion of the raiders. Quite a few groups groups have cleared A3 recently on my server and are working on A4 now, I imagine quite a lot of them will probably get it before the year is over which is well before 3.2. I don't understand the being taught aspect of Savage though you teach your self by observing what is going on, reading up and discussing mechanics with your party. This raid is harder than the Coils were, but all that really matters is clearing it before 3.2 so that you can move onto the next.

Umm... No. The last stats we saw for a4s clears was under 2,000 characters. Things might be getting better locally on your server, but most servers only have 1-2 groups clearing a4s. The only way people are going to get a full savage clear at this point is either by getting better gear or the content is nerfed.

The SREX weapons will help a few groups per server, but we are not going to see clear rates reach above 1% of the player base until there are major nerfs or the content is majorly out geared.

I'm not from a hc raiding server and we have at least 5 groups who have cleared it and quite a few working on the last floor, plenty of groups will clear it eventually, still another 3-5 months until 3.2

[zosia]

I'm not from a hc raiding server and we have at least 5 groups who have cleared it and quite a few working on the last floor, plenty of groups will clear it eventually, still another 3-5 months until 3.2

http://xivsoul.com/

Your server is 7th population wise. It has over 200,000 (rounded down from 225,000 players to account for alts) players on it. If what you are saying is true, and you have 5 groups clearing a4s, that's 40 people. Right now, your server population shows a 0.02% clear rate for savage.

You are playing on one of the best servers and even if we take this argument to extreme lengths, such as assuming out of 225,000 players, only 50,000 have ever played at the level cap, thats still a meager 0.08% of your server population has cleared savage.

I am even willing to take this to an extreme saying that out of those 225,000 characters, only 30k play at the level cap. That's still only 0.13% of your server population has cleared savage and you play on one of the highest populated served.

Even if only 20k characters on your server played at the max level, that's still a 0.2% clear rate. If that number quintupled over the next three months, you would be at a whopping 1% clear rate for your server population.

On one of the best servers, with the most conservative estimates and assuming that clear rates will increase by multiplicative factor of 5, you will see a 1% clear rate among the population by 3.2. The numbers simply don't reflect well on alex savage's sustainability,

The reality is that you are seeing the best of the situation being on such a highly populated server, and even the best situation still leaves you with clear rates well under 1%

[Miscreant]

snip

Even though my server is big it's not the most raid orientated, both Ragnarok and Odin are the raiding servers for the EU and I'm sure both have quite a few more teams who have cleared Savage.

[zosia]

Even though my server is big it's not the most raid orientated, both Ragnarok and Odin are the raiding servers for the EU and I'm sure both have quite a few more teams who have cleared Savage.

I doubt that they are seeing triple digit clear rates, You could take that 40 men on your server, adjust it for a "raiding" server, and you would still see sub 1% clear rates.

The only real raid content in the game should have never been catered to such a small minority. Coil was fine and it looks like we ill be going back to something similar, something that appeals to a much larger raiding audience.

[Velhart]

I doubt that they are seeing triple digit clear rates, You could take that 40 men on your server, adjust it for a "raiding" server, and you would still see sub 1% clear rates.

The only real raid content in the game should have never been catered to such a small minority. Coil was fine and it looks like we ill be going back to something similar, something that appeals to a much larger raiding audience.

May I ask why -one- raid/dungeon in this game has to cater specifically to the casual market? Why shouldn't there be content for the best of the best? The 1% excuse is not viable. With that logic, no MMO's should have really hard end game raids.