Idea for 4.0 Tank Class

[Marxam]

Though I'm still sad Yoshi wants Samurai as dps.

I really hope SAM will be a dps. Given the nature of the game SAM lands its self more to the dps role. I imagine its focused on burst damage similar to DRG. I just want a tank class that can basically do the culmination of PLD and DRK with more focus on party support than dps. I imagine it would have moves that can do aoe mitigation for the party. While I feel that it should do lower damage than the PLD its over all raid wide support will balance it out, similar to how the BRD and MCH work.

[ManaKing]

how about this guy for the next tank? Gunshields anyone?

I'm just going to say that some FF games you could equip 2 shields...also that guy is pretty clown shoes.

Also, as RDM/NIN that used to solo the shit out of FFXI, I can easily say that PLD is pretty darn close to the RDM solo experience. *Engage stamina based DPS tactics* *Cast StoneSkin* *Check to see if StoneSkin is broken* *If unbroken, continue slowly flailing at whatever you deemed worthy of the next 30 minutes of your life* *If broken, make risk assessment of remaining HP* *If minor, MORE STONESKIN!* *If major, cast cure magics! Then MORE STONESKIN!!!* *Go back to slowly strangling the life out of the mob* *If using wireless controller, go make sandwich*

I also primarily play tanks in this game, and i totally get the parallel, because RDM was super tough in FFXI and tanks feel super tough in this game. However, I'm going to have to say that I'd prefer if RDM was as DPS with support based abilities like NIN.

The most important thing to remember is the hat. Everything else is basically less important.

[Fevelle]

So you're basically destroying the style of typical Final Fantasy Red Mage, whom typically only use one handed swords (usually Rapiers) and wear cloth armour.

This game destroys the typical FF jobs already when trying to put them in a raid enviroment where everyone needs to be balanced.

[Rbstr]

I really hope SAM will be a dps. Given the nature of the game SAM lands its self more to the dps role. I imagine its focused on burst damage similar to DRG.

When you look at all the things Samurai has done its a good example for how RDM can work out. You can't really use damage as a way of translating from other games. Warriors and Dark Knights are often big damage dealers. It's not like Samurai has been consistent in much but using katanas and wearing heavy armor. They've had gill toss, shirahadori (blade grab), counters and break skills and the Bushido command is diverse between instant death, buffs, debuffs and big damage.
Samurai could fit DPS with heavier armor like the Dragoon or it could be a tank. It's easy to see either when you've seen it in more than one FF series.
What matters is the style with which it does the job.


Red Mages have a bit of black and white magic and a bit of melee capability. Long as they do that it's a Red Mage.
IMO that works out to being a melee-range version of Bard/Machinist. Black Magic and melee attacks for damage, white magic buffs!

[Xenosan]

Personally I see RDM as Discipline of Magic Caster DPS with a focus on proximity and placement to mobs. A mix of Melee combos and ranged Spell rotations. A gap closer and a gap maker. Throw in a 60-90 recast CD that buffs the ranged spell drastically (but requires range away from target to fully buff the ability like BRD/MCH's DPS in PVP), so RDM use the gap maker to move away from the target and do a spell rotation then gap-close back to the target.

tl;dr: a caster that's max dps is dependent on them moving around - not standing still and turrenting (I agree with the hat comment)

Back to OP. If SE were to ever make another dual job class again like Arcanist, I can really see it being a 'Swordsman' class into Samurai and Sword Master. Sword Master is a bit of a Tactics Orge shout out but then again that's where many FF classes originate anyway.

Other than that obvious pick, Beastmaster?? That'd be a hard job to make into a tank, but man it'd be neat if they could pull that off

[ManaKing]

I would pretty easily take a FFT Geomancer for another tank. They could use axes or sword and shield in that game. Mine generally ran with blade grasp and samurai skills so that they could run into a crowd and piss everything off or kill it. It could also buff or heal with samurai skills and debuff with geomancer skills. I generally used an aegis shield because it was terrible for physical but great for magic defense and a rune blade to pump up their magic damage.

I know thats not a very traditional geomancer but ffs look at half the jobs in this game. I would like a 1h axe and shield tank so it could be a stylistic cross between a PLD and a WAR. The main mechanic i would make central to them would be self shields/temp health bubble triggered off of mechanics similar to inner beast on WAR. Stack that with a shield in their offhand, and they could get some solid mileage out of it. Id ideally code their health bubble independantly from both stone skin and galvanize effects but if i had to choose one or the other i would take it as the stone skin coding since galvanize shields are generally better. Plus as a GEOmancer i would assume it would be earth/stone themed.

While thats really no different than a RDM stoneskin-ing itself over and over, i like to stabby stab stab things with a rapier which implies dps to me. I also want another tank that can equip shields and the only shield you should equip with a rapier is a buckler. And i just dont know how i feel about a tank with a dedicated buckler. I also want that sweet ruinator axe animation back from my BST. God that thing was so good.

I guess while were at it, id probably want the cave in from Mog <ff6>, just boulders falling from the sky. Some lava powers could also be very flashy to add visual appeal.

Since Mog is mentioned as an ancient heroic decendant of moghomme I would expect part of your job quests to have you travel their for further training. Sea of clouds is a land of magical floating rocks. Geomancers could probably learn a lot from an area like that.

[Ultimatecalibur]

Back to OP. If SE were to ever make another dual job class again like Arcanist, I can really see it being a 'Swordsman' class into Samurai and Sword Master. Sword Master is a bit of a Tactics Orge shout out but then again that's where many FF classes originate anyway.

What? I'm pretty certain its the other way around... The first Ogre game (Ogre Battle) was in '93 and FFIII was in '90 and FFV was in '92.

[Anova]

What? I'm pretty certain its the other way around... The first Ogre game (Ogre Battle) was in '93 and FFIII was in '90 and FFV was in '92.

Yasumi Matsuno, the creator of the Tactics game, worked at Quest for the Ogre Battle series and joined Square in 1995. There, he created FFT, Vagrant Story, FFTA, and FFXII before leaving in 2006 for freelance work and the whole JP Arteur thing.

What can I say? I'm a big fan of his work.

On topic: We have enough swords already. Samurai makes a lot of sense as a tank, more so than RDM at least. I think both could work though, and I think there's a definite niche both jobs could fill in the current meta. There is a lot of lore reasons to throw RDM in to the dps support pile, but you could make an argument either way (especially if its based on the mystic knight and spellblade variants). Not so sure about Geomancer as casting gets interrupted by damage and isn't great for a tank (instant cast spells are a work-around), and we already have a very good magic tank with DRK.

[Ultimatecalibur]

Yasumi Matsuno, the creator of the Tactics game, worked at Quest for the Ogre Battle series and joined Square in 1995. There, he created FFT, Vagrant Story, FFTA, and FFXII before leaving in 2006 for freelance work and the whole JP Arteur thing.

What can I say? I'm a big fan of his work.

Wasn't dissing him or anything but was reacting with confusion to the claim that the Ogre series was the origin of many FF classes when the main "job" Final Fantasies predate the series by 1 and 3 years. The only Job that can say it originated in the Ogre series is Mechanist.

[Xenosan]

That's probably correct I've misused my understanding. Astro I'm pretty sure is a reference to the Tarot Card Astromancer Warren of the Ogre.. Was their a beastmaster in early FFs?

I see Ogre more or less as the canon in which they constructed (or expanded/refined) their fantasy genre archetypes. So if it started with FF and that inspired Ogre, and then with Ogre expanded that via it's own universe, which fed back in FF? But might be i'm simplifying and imagining.