Wanderer’s Minuet, Gauss Barrel and Positive Gameplay Additions

[Alahra]

So we can agree there was a decent trade-off for lesser mobility despite the feeling that BRD/MCN got shafted.

It's actually pretty interesting that most of the classes are relatively close on AoE damage now (BLM does about the same as MNK on AS2). SMN's a bit of an exception (they're 400-500 DPS higher than anyone else on AS2, lol), but BLM, BRD, MCH, MNK, and DRG are all somewhat comparable in AoE damage. NIN is really the only noticeably low one (which they should probably do something about).

Especially given that most everyone else has competitive AoE damage, I do still think BRD and MCH probably need some help in the single-target department, as I'd be very surprised if the next raid tier is as friendly to multi-dotting and AoE as this one is. Historically, at least, we've usually gotten one fight per tier that favors multidotting to some extent, sometimes two, and AS2 is only the second raid fight that's had a heavy AoE focus since launch.

[RiceisNice]

I'm not sure if you're playing the same job as I am, but I've noticed a TON of clipping due to the animations for things like barrage, Blood for Blood and Raging Strikes being used after a weaponskill in Minuet. This only becomes even more pronounced when you're using bloodletter regularly.

So, just for the sake of clarity, please don't pretend that an issue doesn't exist just because you're one the exceptions.

It shouldn't clip each other after a weaponskill is what I'm getting at. I have a video uploaded of me using oGCD right after a weaponskill to demonstrate what's wrong with straighter shot, but I can't link it atm on phone.

The one time that your skills clip each other even with a cast time is when you're doing SS right after a HS that gave you a proc, which is a bug because it shouldn't happen


Edit: the wonders of YouTube app.
https://youtu.be/EbqbjJq6-lg

I'm using oGCDs immediately after a weaponskill just fine.

[KaedrianLiang]

i would have been ok with cast times for brd/mch had it been part of the original design starting at level 1, the dev's would have properly designed the whole kit around a cast time.

Right now its as follows, level 1-51 you are learning that brd/mch are mobile ranged dps. Come 52 you get slapped in the face and are encouraged, then eventually forced to relearn the core of the class. This is bad class design.

The best compromise would have allowed mobility on top of the cast time.

[UnstablePersonality]

i would have been ok with cast times for brd/mch had it been part of the original design starting at level 1, the dev's would have properly designed the whole kit around a cast time.

Right now its as follows, level 1-51 you are learning that brd/mch are mobile ranged dps. Come 52 you get slapped in the face and are encouraged, then eventually forced to relearn the core of the class. This is bad class design.

The best compromise would have allowed mobility on top of the cast time.

Or the extra damage without the cast time entirely.

[Alahra]

Or the extra damage without the cast time entirely.

Personally, I wish BRD/MCH DPS was higher without the stance (enough that you don't need to use the stance all the time) and then turning on the stance would be thought of as a bonus in situations where you can afford to sit still. I also feel like the stance-only skills should be usable outside of them. Obviously, numbers might have to be adjusted for something like this, but in terms of gameplay, I think something along those lines would feel a lot better.

[Judge_Xero]

I'm curious how a 1 second Cast would work with Bard.

[Alahra]

I'm curious how a 1 second Cast would work with Bard.

I've thought about that too, actually. A 1-second cast would line up more or less with the point at which you can use oGCDs on a normal GCD, which might do something to fix some of the latency/awkward timing issues that are currently present. That's tricky too, though, because I'm pretty sure 1 second is short enough that you could stutter step with a great deal of freedom, almost defeating the purpose of cast times in the first place.

[RiceisNice]

I'm curious how a 1 second Cast would work with Bard.

It'd just be a more mobile person of what we have now, more window for stepping inbertween. It might resolve SS's proc not occuring in time, buit they'd still only be able to use 1 oGCD (which I feel is still very cumbersome with bloodletter)/

On a side thought, one way they could have differentiated GB/WM was making one reduce your GCD to 1.5 seconds with a .5 second cast time (meaning they still can't move freely) and reducing TP costs of your skills. That could have been given to MCH and make them play a little bit more differently than BRD (whom could have stayed motile, because really the aspect of mobility is overrated from a balance standpoint, player-preference aside, or reworkin river of blood to give a stacking buff that increases BL damage or something.)

[Alahra]

the aspect of mobility is overrated from a balance standpoint

If mobility is in fact over-rated, why do you think the developers decided to move BRD and MCH to a cast time playstyle? I'm not asking that to be snarky, I'd like to know your thoughts on why they would add cast times to them if mobility isn't an issue.

[RiceisNice]

If mobility is in fact over-rated, why do you think the developers decided to move BRD and MCH to a cast time playstyle? I'm not asking that to be snarky, I'd like to know your thoughts on why they would add cast times to them if mobility isn't an issue.

Because not everything the developers do are honestly well thought out at times, nor would this be the first example of it (the other times making DRG so prone to dying to magical damage and designing an entire raid instance behind it, and the absurdly low 20% buff from WM/GB even making to the final release build). I mean you really can't get any worse than making two skills that are functionally the same. Even if they have to have cast times, why do they still function more-or-less the same around it (which also dips into the design of MCH, who is supposed to be an entirely new job)? BLM and SMN both have cast times, but the fundamental basis of their damage is greatly differentiated (hard hitting casts vs DoTs and oGCDs).

The other thought is that even though mobility is supposed to be the tradeoff for their naturally low damage, they were still consistently behind of the likes of BLM and SMN (which means the offset is either not doing enough or doing anything at all in that given fight.) And while between the two casters, itemization aside, both are fairly even in what they can pull off, even though SMN is arguably more motile.

Put it in perspective like this. BRD and MCH are both more-or-less in equal terms of dps, but one is more motile than the other. Is that not the same context when it was SMN/BLM in 2.0 where SMN was arguably more motile than the other, granted the two still had entirely different fundamentals. Of course people will typically flock to whatever is the "easier" to grasp, but I honestly don't think that's a problem if they're still equal in performance with similar rikes. A lot of people say that "MCH is a lot more work for the same damage as BRD", and while it's true to an extent (being extremely reactive to procs and bathooven simulator for wildfire), I still find it fun and much more enjoyable than the current state of BRD (whom, despite all it's kinks, has less to worry about since they can't react to procs and still performs relatively well). Imo, its a valid reason for a job to be under-represented if it's because it's considered more "difficult" for valid reasons (again, BLM and SMN being a prime example since using DWT effectively is much more loose than trying to maintain enochian, especially in the admist of mechanics) , not because it's underperforming.