Wanderer’s Minuet, Gauss Barrel and Positive Gameplay Additions

[Alahra]

As for mobility being a huge asset in mechanics...I really do not agree with this.

You misunderstand my point. I don't think the developers use mobility as a balancing metric, generally. However, the playerbase does, in general, prefer mobility to a lack of it. Given that MCH and BRD are more similar than BLM and SMN are (bustcasts versus DoT damage is a significant playstyle difference), people are generally going to gravitate toward whichever mage's damage style appeals to them more for the two casters.

For BRD and MCH, though, their basic functionality is the same and BRD was historically the most mobile class, making it the goto for numerous raid mechanics (slime-kiting in T1, Renauds in T7 [for groups without SMNs], mines and towers in T8, Charm-baiting in Ramuh EX, Redfire in T12, etc.). Higher mobility also allows for better DPS while learning mechanics and on highly mobile fights (Titan EX, T11). I doubt, given the option between a MCH with cast times and a BRD with no cast times, that a significant number of people would favor MCH in Titan EX unless MCH's damage potential was much higher. Since they can't give one class higher damage than the other, the simplest option was to give both of them cast times.

[StouterTaru]

As for mobility being a huge asset in mechanics...I really do not agree with this.

ADHD bards were incredibly annoying, and now they no longer exist. That makes me happy.

I would support removing WM/GB only if there was a new mechanic introduced that kept them from zig-zagging and screwing up mechanics.

[RiceisNice]

. I doubt, given the option between a MCH with cast times and a BRD with no cast times, that a significant number of people would favor MCH in Titan EX unless MCH's damage potential was much higher. Since they can't give one class higher damage than the other, the simplest option was to give both of them cast times.

This ultimately comes down to again, playstyle preference on the players themselves. I still ran with a BLM in the likes of T11, because they very much like the BLM playstyle compared toSMN, and a good BLM can play just as well as a good SMN in a given fight without too big of a discrepancy . What we have right now, I don't even feel like I'm making a choice based on playstyle, but rather which job functions better as a whole (because they both play reactively to procs, but only MCH can manage that).

Even in your xamples of kiting, all of those do not amoutn to a lot of mobility downtime in the long run because they're not so much as kiting as much as it is "sitting there and dps from a range". I even mentioned for the redfire mechanic in T12, bluefire gimps your dps so hard that it doesn't matter if you can attack on the move or not.

When a job becomes underplayed because of their performance and their inherent design that gets in the way of the fights (such as DRG's absurdly low magic defense in FCoB, or PLD's lack of advantages in savage), thats when it needs to change up a bit.

ADHD bards were incredibly annoying, and now they no longer exist. That makes me happy.

I would support removing WM/GB only if there was a new mechanic introduced that kept them from zig-zagging and screwing up mechanics.

This largely falls onto the individual player. Their freedom of mobility isn't evne encouraged most of the time and they get absolutely no benefit from doing so. Otherwise I could say just as much as giving BLM instant casts so they would stop standing in AoEs and dying to it.

[kazeandi]

Well since I run Enochian, I stare at my timers more than at the environment. Whenever I have to move, Enochian is in danger of falling off, so I have to sacrifice damage to save it. With just ONE refresh I have a downtime of 15 seconds where I devolve into a 2.0 mage. With 2 refreshes Enochian runs smoothly, but that's something you can only pull off if you can stand still - which becomes an increasingly rare thing. And it's not just the timers, we also have our procs to watch out for, right. Remove one or the other and it's okay, but juggling both is stressful.
I'd say BLM is among the harder to play DDs now.

That's the thing, SE caters to twitchy players who like button mashing. If I wanted that, I'd play Diablo 3.

Class A: Squeeze as many off-GCD abilities in as possible.
Class B: Add positionals as much as possible.
Class C: One timer isn't enough, let's add another.

What's the deal I wonder. It's hard to make encounters interesting so let's make the classes more complicated?
I mean it's not that it's not doable - it just bloats your bars and takes away the strategic element. If you had less timers to watch, you could react more to what's going on around you.

And to return to the topic: I don't like HOW they implemented WM. Not THAT they implemented it. How about removing the procs from the Bard and instead give them more combo actions?

[RiceisNice]

And to return to the topic: I don't like HOW they implemented WM. Not THAT they implemented it. How about removing the procs from the Bard and instead give them more combo actions?

You don't need to be on point with BLM procs since you don't have a reason to trigger it as soon as it comes (which is a problem in 2.0 due to your cast times being as long as your GCD, but not the case in 3.0 since you dont consectutively use fire I, and the circumstances of using fire I/III has changed; you're using it to refresh astral fire, not damage). On BRD's end, weaving their oGCD procs is still integral to their dps, but it just doesn't mesh well with their moveset that it doesn't flow very well and has a lot of pauses because of the cast times that interfere with using more than 1 oGCD

As far as BRD/MCH is concerned, I'd like for them to expand on one of the two jobs so they have more distinguishing gameplay where they need to manage their stacks or buffs differently. Ammo for MCH isn't even managed all that well because it's used for every weaponskill and you have such a short cooldown on it that it becomes anotehr oGCD for damage (unlike aetherflow which acts as "ammounition" for specific abilties, as well as timing the use of said abilties to get proper uptime on DWT, MCH ammo literally, is just there.)

[kazeandi]

Well the procs of the BLM can be utilized for DPS, depending on when they occur and when you plan to build them in. You know where in your cycle you are and when you'd wanna make use of them. But the moment you have to move, it all tumbles down and you need to use them ASAP to do some kind of damage, or you let them run out while trying to keep Astral Fire and Enochian running while evading the AOE while managing your mana

Maybe I'm too old for this kind of multitasking, but I like this game. I liked the BLM because of its reliable rotation, which made it easier to play (mind you, you could still tell a good mage from a bad one), but now the class has become so hectic, that I can play a good instance, maybe two, then I have to take a break from exhaustion.

As for GB/WM, there are lots of ways to convert the systems, and there are people way better informed than me (my highest bard is in the 30s, but I'm working on her at the moment). I hope they make it fun as in you can be creative with your skills and flexible, not as in there are 5 things to juggle, focus like a zen monk or do 40% less damage.

[Avidria]

What really bothered me about WM is that it felt like it wasn't useful at all until 60. I didn't use it once until 56, and even then I didn't keep it up all the time. So I get a skill that isn't worth using at 52, gets a bit more appealing at 54 but still isn't great, isn't really useful until 56 (and do I love iron jaws on its own), and then a one-time debuff protection spell (with a castbar!) that seems to be very situationally useful at 58.

Then at 60 I get sidewinder, which is actually pretty nice and has a cool animation (and doesn't require WM, which is also great).

So I didn't really start "powering up" as it were until 56. The change from being totally mobile to having cast bars was pretty jarring as well. I just started playing the game a few months ago so I don't know how things were pre 3.0, and I don't mind WM so much now that I've gotten used to it, but it does seem like an odd class design post-50.

Meanwhile my WHM seemed to get a cool and (immediately) useful ability after every 52+ quest. :/

[Indiction]

I'm just really wishing for a revamp of MCH (although I don't play it) and BRD. It's just too much copy/paste tbh...If making 3 classes is really all that much work, AND we end up with the BRD-clone that MCH is, then just release 1-2 at a time SE. There really is no point of a "new" class if it isn't actually new. I watch MCHs play in dungeons, but it doesn't seem like there's significant playstyle differences between my playstyle and their's...

*Really hoping we get a big ol' huge revamp like some of the other classes have, 'cuz, as some people have said, I felt no "wow" factor in any of the skills from 50+.
My impressions:
WM - Okay, cast times....well then
Emp Arrow - Okay...you're making up for our loss of dmg via auto attacks...
Iron Jaws - Okay...neat? Helps with tp I suppose
Warden's Paeon - *2 seconds after using* Okay I can't even imagine myself using such a high-castime, low utility skill, ever...
Sidewinder - Nice damage I suppose...but...is that all?

I don't want just cd down on this and potency increase on that. I really just want MCH/BRD to be different and feel overall just not as lackluster..I am a bard, I sing, I support. Why the fudge does a gun-wielding dps class even offer this? There's no logic to the machines even providing this.. =-= If anything, the turrets should offer different types of dps (Blunt, piercing, aoe, single target, cone) to fit situations and job debuffs on enemies.

[RiceisNice]

I don't want just cd down on this and potency increase on that. I really just want MCH/BRD to be different and feel overall just not as lackluster..I am a bard, I sing, I support. Why the fudge does a gun-wielding dps class even offer this? There's no logic to the machines even providing this.. =-= If anything, the turrets should offer different types of dps (Blunt, piercing, aoe, single target, cone) to fit situations and job debuffs on enemies.

The two are competing for the raid slot of "support dps" or physical ranged dps whatever. If MCH didn't have any tools for party regen, they would not be desired in progression when healers ahve to overtime for mana. Unless you want them to compete with casters for the raid slot of a true-ranged dps, where you now have 3 ranged dps and BRD will still fill their own little niche.

That being said though, I would have loved for them to build more onto MCH closer to what they had presented with the various attachments or even ammunition effect (being required for skills). Outside of using bursts, they have nothing out of the ordinary that makes them too different from BRD, other than fundamental problems on re-active procs (which again they both have).

[Raist]

My main gripe was that they added a song that was actually a stance. They missed a golden opportunity to focus BRD on the utility side. They could have given it a buffing song like Valor Minuet (aoe ATT buff), a Madrigal (aoe ACC buff), a minne (aoe DEF buff), or even a march (haste) or paeon ( aoe regen).

Here's hoping they see the light with the next level cap increase...