Angry Bards

[Velhart]

Wait, you actually think BLM rotation is hard? BLM rotation is actually very simple. The only time there's any difficulty to BLM is literally only when there's movement required, and that has nothing to do with rotation, but Enochian upkeep. Any time you're able to turret, you've got the easiest rotation.

BLM is the class I play when I don't want to have to do too much to get big numbers.

BRD is still arguably the easiest DPS in the game to play.

[Maero]

No class is overly hard, blm it is about enochian up keep which yes is easy but sometimes mechanics do mess you right up. All comes down to how well the player knows how to play a class.
Also agree with Velhart in that Bard is still one of the easiest classes to play, 2.x Bard had it way too easy.
QOL fixes in terms of timing and also have it so Bards are not punished as much from singing to support the group would be good. Again pretty much only those with no experience as a caster find the cast times being the issue, when it is not the real problem.

@Aiselia The statement of playing the class to get big numbers without doing much just shows you obviously do not play blm all too much, it is just an ignorant statement to be honest.
Not arguing about the rotation but the one thing you said. If we are talking rotations, Bard is not overly complex either i would say Monk or Drg still has more depth.

[Aiselia]

@Aiselia The statement of playing the class to get big numbers without doing much just shows you obviously do not play blm all too much, it is just an ignorant statement to be honest.
Not arguing about the rotation but the one thing you said.

And since I was talking about the rotation, if you're not arguing about the rotation, then in what way is it wrong?

Sorry, but if you're going to say that it's ignorant, you'd better back that up.

How is the rotation complex and difficult, not counting if movement causes you to skip a cast and go into UI before you're out of MP so you can keep up Enochian?

[mdha02]

I was saying BLM rotation is harder than BRD. If you screw up on BRD it doesn't take as much effort to correct it like it does on BLM. If you screw up those big numbers you are saying are so easy to get, become smaller.

[Aiselia]

I was saying BLM rotation is harder than BRD.

The BLM rotation is incredibly simple. You said it was "way harder". It's not.

Boss mechanics aren't part of a rotation.

[Demi_God]

Hi, i208 BRD here, I am very unhappy with the bard changes and will definitely be playing something else next tier or very soon if changes are not made.

[mdha02]

Let me try this again. The BLM rotation is harder to pull off during a fight. If you screw up and lose Enochian, you have to revert to the 2.0 rotation unit it's off its CD. Which shouldn't be long, but we all know that seconds can feel like minutes during boss fights. BRDs don't have to worry about performing a certain rotation to keep WM up. It's up from the moment you put it up, until you take it down.

I would like to see the BRDs who are so unhappy post why they are so unhappy and their viable solution to these problems. Rather than them just saying. You broke my job, if you don't fix it I'm going to play another job. Or the ones that are threatening to quit. You want the cast time associated with WM to go away? Ok, but your probably going to loose your 30% damage buff.

[ColdestHeaven]

BLM rotation is easy. BLM was never about hard rotations. That is, if you define "rotation" as in "sequence of skills you need to use to achieve optimal DPS". Fire3-Fire4-Fire4-Fire-Fire4-Fire4-Blizzard3 is easy compared to what NIN has to do, for example.

Keeping an optimal DPS and rotation while having to move because of mechanics, and resuming it when you stop moving - now, that is harder. Mdha02 simply did not word it right at first. Saying "it's easy if you are not moving" is kinda like saying "healing a tankbuster is easy if tanks are using hallowed ground"; at least that's how I see it. I saw a linked video in one of these threads that actually made me chuckle. I wish BLM were able to do this and not lose on any Fire4 cast...

[RiceisNice]

I saw a linked video in one of these threads that actually made me chuckle. I wish BLM were able to do this and not lose on any Fire4 cast...

People need to stop using that video as a comparison to mobility when it's rather moot in context. There's a difference between moving when you have to (which a BLM can still do by step-casting during the last .5 seconds) and moving when you don't need to, and all the video demonstrates is the latter which honestly means jack shite in a raid environment because telegraphed AoEs allow for stepping anyway.

Both jobs lose dps either way when a mechanic forces them to be on the move like Ravana Orbs or baiting puddles. I don't move that much in 2.0, and me and the BLM certainly don't move that much in Savage, and it certainly wasn't the case before in 2.x if casters were still on average doing more dps than BRDs even if you were to factor out requiem

[ColdestHeaven]

1000charsnip

BLM can step-cast, but can they do it easily and reliably in order to dodge without losing on any Fire4 cast (which sums up to a lot of their damage)? My answer is no. BRD cast time are rather short compared to BLM, you can use step-cast and you will basically always have enough time to dodge that one attack coming in the wrong moment. BLM casts are about double of that, and if you either delay your cast or interrupt it because you now have to dodge, you have to watch two timers laughing at you. The discussion was about how easy it is to recover to mechanics screwing you.
Also: that video is no mere "comparison" - it just shows you how a BRD can move basically anywhere in their rotation and still not suffer much in terms of lost uptime. Black mages, on the other hand, have stricter timings for that - unless they want to lose on "lots of easy damage". You have 30-25-20 seconds to cast two Fire and four Fire4, but that's not even half the issue, because astral fire wears off in about 3 seconds after the second Fire4. I am no BLM main, but from what I can tell from personal experience in both Minuet and level 60 BLM I wouldn't really consider BLM easier to manage in that sense. It's quite hectic, and not in the sense of "DPS efficiency", but class mechanics. BLM is way slower in recovering from a fuck-up, and being slow not only in Savage but other content too is not really good nor pleasant - I believe that much we can agree on.