Am I the only one fed up with DPS obsession?

[Nurvus]

I don't know what WoW you were playing, but every healer was supposed to DPS as well. Disc was just the best healer WHILE DPSing. Holy had a Chakra for that. Fistweaving was a thing. I know you can't have forgotten Shockadins. Even Druids and Shamans were supposed to DPS. I know for a fact there was some bonus for my heals if I DPSed while healing on a Shaman. And tanks there were also supposed to DPS. That's why they made Vengeance a thing, so even the MT could beat things down. So if you're going to use WoW as an example of why healers should get to be lazy and not DPS, you're doing it wrong.

Not only you are making stuff up (because in WoW healers spend 101% of the time healing at the highest difficulties), you completely missed the point Alisi was trying to make.
Alisi was talking about wanting encounters to challenge a Healer through Healing-related mechanics.
When Healing is trivial and what makes a good healer is how much DPS he can do while healing, then that's not challenging his ability to Heal.

[Isala]

Not only you are making stuff up (because in WoW healers spend 101% of the time healing at the highest difficulties), you completely missed the point Alisi was trying to make.
Alisi was talking about wanting encounters to challenge a Healer through Healing-related mechanics.
When Healing is trivial and what makes a good healer is how much DPS he can do while healing, then that's not challenging his ability to Heal.

Alright. Time to drop some knowledge.

Let's start with Shamans. Conductivity. Level 75 Talent. Extends the duration of your Healing Rain while you cast DPS spells. Telluric Currents. Level 10 ability. Causes several DPS spells to have no DPS cost... But we're not supposed to DPS.

Monks. I don't even have to go into their talents. They were literally designed around causing healing while they DPS. Hence the term FISTWEAVING.

Druids. Heart of the Wild. Increases your ability to do literally anything but heal. Level 90 Talent. OR, in that very same tier, Nature's Vigil. For 30 seconds all attacks and heals radiate healing effect to nearby allies. 20% for heals, 40%! for attacks. But Druids aren't supposed to attack either.

Paladins. Supplication. Level 34 ability. For 8 seconds after YOU KILL AN ENEMY, your Flash of Light (healing spell) will be increased by 50% and has 100% increased Critical Chance. Selfless healer. Level 45 Talent. Your Judgements (attack spell) reduce the Mana cost and cast time of your Flash of Light. Stacks 3 times. Nope! No DPS here.

Priests. Discipline Priest. Atonement. I really don't have to say a damn thing after this.

Priests. Holy Priest. Power Word: Solace. Level 45 Talent. Strike an enemy to regain mana, and heal a nearby target for 100% of the damage, or 50% if it heals the Priest. Twist of Fate. Level 75 Healer Talent. Increases damage and healing dealt when healing a target below 35% Or how about the big one. Chakra: Chastise. Level 56 Ability. Increases the damage of Shadow and Holy spells by 50%. Converts your Holy Word spell into Holy Word: Chastise. Which is an attack, if you didn't know. But nope. Even with a stance for DPSing, priests aren't supposed to DPS, either.

Next time you wanna call me out for posting incorrect information, maybe you should actually know what you are talking about yourself. Every single healer in the game had a bonus to their healing somewhere along the way if they DPSed as well, or in Holy Priest's case, a complete DPS stance.

Just like here, a healer could add to the DPS of the group, but unlike here, it was actually partially beneficial to the healer itself to do so. Here, there is no reason to DPS as a healer, other than to add to the DPS. In WoW, you increased your power by alternating DPS and healing abilities. No. You were not supposed to go ham on the boss, like you are here. That's not what I was saying. I was saying that yeah, you did DPS. Maybe not fully, but you were always tossing something at the boss to keep your stacks up. When you tie in Mana regen into several offensive abilities, you really had no choice, unless you wanted to go OOM. A healer who did not DPS a little was gimping themselves, and by extension their party.

Do I like the fact that the challenge is to push out as much DPS as possible, while keeping the minimum amount of heals required for your group? Hell no. But let's be real here. That's not going to change. There will always be healers expected to DPS during fights that require DPS checks. When your DPS classes can't cut it, the burden falls onto the tanks and healers to make it up. Is there another way to design an encounter, though? That's really the question. When there are hard enrages, you have no choice but to put out as much damage as possible. But if you don't put in hard enrages, people cheese the fight completely. Look at T2 for a good example of that.

[Alisi]

SNIP.

Do you even know how the specs in WoW work? You get ONE of the three spells and no healer would take your choices.

Conductivity over Rushing Streams? LMAO! No Pally healer will take Selfless healer over Eternal Flame. Heart of the Wild INCREASES HEALING by 35% when you're a resto druid. A holy priest won't take Solace over mind bender or surge of light.

No healer would DPS above what they need to do to get MP back or heal or buff their heals. Healing is much easier and lighter in this game. You have all sorts of things you take for granted. In WoW, you can't DPS above what you need for the above because of MP issues. That's part of the healing game in WoW. You get ONE single pot for an entire fight, a very limited pool of battle revs, and most of the OMG spells cost a great deal. No one can waste their MP on DPS unless it's working for their healing in some way.

[Nurvus]

Alright. Time to drop some knowledge.

SNIP

You could copy-paste all the information about WoW that you want, but if you try to say that - on content you and your group do NOT overgear - you don't have to focus 99% of your effort on healing, then you ARE indeed making stuff up.

And even when you do DPS as a healer in WoW, it is always directly or indirectly improving your Healing which does NOT happen in FFXIV:ARR.
Example:
Priest's Atonement heals based on your damage with Smite/Holy Fire, so you are still Healing.
Druid's Nature's Vigil makes you heal when you damage.

And I don't mind DPSing as a Healer.
But the main challenge for a Healer should be healing, and in FFXIV:ARR it does not seem to be the case.

[Isala]

And even when you do DPS as a healer in WoW, it is always directly or indirectly improving your Healing which does NOT happen in FFXIV:ARR.

No. You were not supposed to go ham on the boss, like you are here. That's not what I was saying. I was saying that yeah, you did DPS. Maybe not fully, but you were always tossing something at the boss to keep your stacks up. When you tie in Mana regen into several offensive abilities, you really had no choice, unless you wanted to go OOM.

That is literally what I said. I never said you were supposed to go to the extremes we do here to blast away at the boss as much as possible. All I said, was that yes, healers in WoW DID add to the DPS.

[Nurvus]

That is literally what I said. I never said you were supposed to go to the extremes we do here to blast away at the boss as much as possible. All I said, was that yes, healers in WoW DID add to the DPS.

Except you try to use it as a means to refute a point, whereas I explained that adding to DPS as a healer is 1% of your job in WoW, and when you do add to DPS you are also healing or contributiong towards your healing.
Therefore the focus/priority on DPS as a Healer in WoW is close to 0%.

I'm not here to duel.
The point is simple and clear:
I - and many others - want the game to challenge my ability to Heal when I'm a healer.
WoW does that.
FFXIV:AR does not - here the healing is devoid of complexity or depth, and is just a filler task for a Healer. You are ultimately still only challenged in DPS.

The same for Tanking.
In WoW - after a few years - Tanks also have "active mitigation", which is to say they have to watch out for survival mechanics the same way DPS watch out for dps mechanics - and I'm not talking about big cooldowns.
Therefore your ability to Tank is challenged when you are a Tank, although you also are challenged in DPS due to the need to generate threat (and tank dps is ultimately accounted for when setting the goal).
In FFXIV:ARR, your "tanking" is either baked into your attacks or consists of a premeditated defensive cooldown rotation - there is no challenge in that.

SE needs to step up their game in many areas, but specially in Healing and Tanking actually being the main challenges for Healers and Tanks, respectively - not DPS.