DRG rant, is it really only just me? (Melee DPS balance).

[Ixsiehn]

EDIT: I no longer fully believe what I mentioned in this post, but I am leaving this up for context and for further discussion

Having mained melee since 2.0 (mostly on DRG, and NIN, but enough on MNK to know ins and outs), I've always found that SE and the community seems to love their baby MNK and really hate their unwanted child DRG (and NIN now, with the coming of NINs).

I personally feel that monks DID NOT need the 3% damage buff to greased lightning. (Yes, incoming downvotes from MNKs, you'll see)

Warning: Super long read, TLDR at the bottom.

Brief history of the melee classes back in ARR pre-NIN:

in terms of ST DPS:

MNK > DRG

in terms of AoE DPS:

DRG > MNK

in terms of flexibility:

MNK > DRG

Dragoons have a rigid rotation, you cannot fit dots in between your combos as they are running out.

in terms of Difficulty to learn:

MNK > DRG

This one has been repeated many times everywhere, I agree, monks are harder to learn, their flexibility makes it harder to learn to play monks.

in terms of Difficulty to master:

DRG > MNK

The lack of flexibility of DRGs make them harder to master in a raid setting, not to mention how missing a positional means no buff, debuff or main DoT.

Switching targets as a dragoon mid combo means you're doing sub-optimal combo DPS on the second target until you are done with the combo then you can start setting debuffs (which are ironically part of your combo).

Monks switch target a lot easier as their rotation is flexible, switching targets also has no impact on the timing in which they can apply dots, as they can easily do it mid-combo.

I dont think I need to mention the DRG jumps in raids right?

in terms of Utility:

MNK > DRG

DRGs get disembowel, which buffed bards. MNKs get dragon kick, which buffs other monks and reduces incoming spell damage (oh hey, 95% of all raid damage is spell damage!!). MNKs also have superior mantra.

MNKs have both a stun AND a silence, yes, the silence is harder to pull off than on a BRD, but its possible to do so, and was needed in T1 and T2, when our bard didn't turn up for raid, we had our MNK do a silence. It is a DPS loss, but if we had no MNK and instead had a DRG, we'd have to cancel raid.

And then NINs came, which completely outclassed DRG in EVERY possible way, except for AoE DPS. (Pre-DRG buff and NIN nerf).

in terms of ST DPS:

MNK > NIN > DRG

in terms of AoE DPS:

DRG > MNK >= NIN

in terms of flexibility:

MNK > NIN >= DRG

NINs have the same flexibility issue as DRGs, but their lack of the need of positionals makes NIN slightly better than DRGs in that regard.

in terms of Difficulty to learn:

MNK > DRG > NIN

NIN plays like a DRG who doesnt have jump, and instead merges all the jumps into a weird mini-game (Which coughs out greased lightning among other things).

in terms of Difficulty to master:

DRG > MNK > NIN

NIN's only difficulty is fighting latency, and they have a minor version of the flexibility issues of DRGs, but they don't have the extremely punishing positional requirements of DRGs and definitely not as numerous as MNKs (only 1 total every 60 seconds). Their main debuff and dot ability placements are much easier to access within the combo than as compared to DRGs too. (MNKs are flexible, the furthest GCD a monk will ever have for being out of reach of a skill is 2 unless you screw up your rotation so badly you need to apply 2 buffs/debuffs immediately, but even then, it's rare that'd you'd need 4 GCDs or more).

in terms of Utility:

NIN > MNK > DRG

Ninjas came in with major utility options: Goad for the other TP DPS, trick attack for raid wide DPS increase, slashing damage debuff (if theres no WAR), and the ability to stun or silence (more easily than a monk can).

The track record so far makes me wonder if SE knows how to even balance the melee DPS, then came with what would be a "fix" but made me question why on some changes:

• DRGs finally get the much needed QoL and DPS buff (they still do less DPS than MNKs, who have been reigning as Top DPS easier to master melee DPS the ENTIRE duration of ARR EDIT: I stand corrected, DRGs beat MNKs after the buff)
• DRGs no longer have stupidly punishing positional requirements, making them actually easier to master than monks overall (the unflexibility is still a thing, but monks still had GL to contend with).
• NIN got a TP cost nerf, which made goad virtually useless. The only reason goad was useful was because ninja was the least TP hungry melee DPS, so they could goad the other melee, making it so that the BRD wont have to TP song so soon, with the TP cost nerf, ninja skyrocketed to becoming the most TP hungry melee DPS, making it so that before they would even use Goad, the BRD will have to TP song.
• NIN got a minor dps nerf.

and then come HW:
n terms of ST DPS:

DRG > MNK > NIN

Take note, this is referring to Dummy ST DPS

in terms of AoE DPS:

MNK > DRG > NIN

in terms of flexibility:

MNK > NIN > DRG

DRGs get hit even hard with the HW changes, with everything that's new contributing to making DRGs even more unflexible than it already is, adding a 4th (RNG) attack to our combo, and the new BotD mechanic giving us a GL that is possibly much more punishing, or much less punishing depending on when BotD was dropped, and requires the dragoon to foresee 45-60 seconds to know if it's worth using that BotD (in most cases, the dragoon wont know until they experience the fight enough times to get the timing down.)

in terms of Difficulty to learn:

DRG > MNK > NIN

DRGs became much harder to learn now thanks to the new rotation and geirskogul's interaction with BotD (which makes BotD much harder to maintain for new comers, unless they completely do not use geirskogul at all, which is a significant DPS loss). NIN barely changed at all, MNKs gained more QoL boosts that makes them easier to play.

in terms of Difficulty to master:

DRG > MNK > NIN

the QoL boosts to monk allowing them to drop GL for burst and then charging chakra during downtime made them even more flexible to the situation, now Downtimes lasting longer than they can get GL3 back aren't as punishing as before. DRGs suffer from old GL syndrome and they need to know to not re-apply BotD before a downtime (e.g. A1S), or they will have no BotD when the boss comes back (a fucked up BotD can make a dragoon have to wait for 45 seconds, a fucked up GL is at most 8 base GCDs in length, as their GCDs get shorter and shorter as they slowly stack their GL stacks.[this is not even counting PB which can get them all 3 back if needed])

That being said, the lack of flexibility and the difficulty to actually perform a DRGs optimal rotation during an actual raid makes DRGs and MNKs equal out in actual raids. (MNKs doing more dps thanks to battle litany buff if they are in the same raid)

In terms of utility:

NIN > DRG >= MNK

The only 1 new utility DRG got was battle litany, a 15% crit chance buff over 20 seconds, but at a 180 seconds CD. This is inferior to trick attack in ST fights (60 seconds CD vs 180 seconds CD), but superior in AoE phases, it also applies to healing (but heals dont really rely on crit as much as crit is a bonus boost to heals). This is pretty much an offensive/defensive hybrid equivalent to mantra, except its used for offense much more than defense, since relying on Battle Litany to heal is stupid. Mantra on the other hand, helps healers with heals in heal intensive phases (and has much less CD), this also allows healers to worry less about healing and to DPS more often on progression. Battle Litany is still a superior offensive CD to mantra, but mantra is a superior defensive CD, and indirectly boosts raid dps too.

The only utility i find that DRGs have over MNKs now is disembowel, since the change to LB, stacking MNKs isn't as great, and DRKs now apply the spell damage debuff too.

And then, SE had to screw the MNK/DRG balance by giving monk superior ST DPS yet again.

MNKs now excel in ST, AoE DPS and defensive utility.

NINs excel in offensive utility, they cry alone at night about their DPS, and then DRGs are now the "disembowel bitch" for BRDs, at least they did much better DPS than back in 2.0, but requires much more effort.

TLDR
MNKs always top DPS from start til end despite being easier to master and still have the best defensive utility. NINs have the best offensive utility all around, but suffer from lacking DPS. DRGs master nothing, they lost their "Top AoE DPS (useless niche)" to MNKs, and have inferior offensive utility to NINs.

When will SE stop babying MNKs?