Strength Tanks and You.

[Khemorex]

snip.

this thread has splitted in to 2 directions actually.

1 : the ones that trying to prove str tanks are the only way to go and anything else is just bullshit and not worth to play :P

with stuff like posting parses and math .

and stuff like :

*being an hinderence to your group using vit*
*ur farming slower then me* huhu *i farm it 4 min faster then you my dingding is bigger*

2 : then thers str tanks wich actually are only saying its ok to play str nothign wrong with it if ur group can keep up with it.

[Kirana]

snip

Umm...thanks for proving my point? Saving more than 3 minutes on every dungeon is great...

[Eye_Gore]

this thread has splitted in to 2 directions actually.

Well, then there is only one thing left to do. 9 rounds bare knuckle boxing, its the only way.

[Khemorex]

Umm...thanks for proving my point? Saving more than 3 minutes on every dungeon is great...

thats great for you , dosnt make it anymore less or worth to go in with vit gear XD

[CrystalRainbow]

It's a balance.

As people get over gears switching to STR is smart things die quicker as long as you can hold hate. But...
New content you need all the vit you can get. Also VIT is very important in pugs.

[Kirana]

thats great for you , dosnt make it anymore less or worth to go in with vit gear XD

But...it does. Vit gear loses all worth after a point. The clear fact that you can trade that vit for something valuable makes it less worth to run full vit.

[Izsha]

this thread has splitted in to 2 directions actually.

1 : the ones that trying to prove str tanks are the only way to go and anything else is just bullshit and not worth to play :P

with stuff like posting parses and math .

and stuff like :

*being an hinderence to your group using vit*
*ur farming slower then me* huhu *i farm it 4 min faster then you my dingding is bigger*

2 : then thers str tanks wich actually are only saying its ok to play str nothign wrong with it if ur group can keep up with it.

You conveniently forgot the vit heros screaming str tanks aren't tanks. Vit is life. Life is tank. Tank is vit. Repent ye str heathens and accept the one true stat into your heart as is your role!

Str or die crowd: relax. We know it's the optimal way to play, but it also has a minimum group skill threshold many groups don't have. It's great to aspire to, but don't force it. Not everyone can handle the power (of str).

Vit or die crowd: quit with your 1 dimensional view of tanking. It's narrowminded and ignorant. There is no holy book of tank the decrees all shall wear vit because "it's tank gear and tank is the name of your role".

Reasonable human beings in the middle that realize group dynamics and skill determine how to gear: Thank you. You get it.

[Khemorex]

But...it does. Vit gear loses all worth after a point. The clear fact that you can trade that vit for something valuable makes it less worth to run full vit.

ahem , for what? so that i can stand afk 3 more minutus in idyllshire?

then i prefer to have more hp ty

[healthetank]

ahem , for what? so that i can stand afk 3 more minutus in idyllshire?

then i prefer to have more hp ty

Why are you being intentionally obtuse? Vit is good to a point. After that point, it is worthless. Actually worthless. It doesn't affect the fight whatsoever. STR doesn't have that point (yet). Why would you purposely handicap yourself? Just to stay stubborn? Go for it.

[Gyson]

Snipped for making several assumptions to pad numbers in favor of STR tanking

Not "bad math". My math was based on a 4 minute window (your statement, by the way) with the generous assumption that a tank was responsible for 1/8th of the total damage dealt, and only replacing one STR tank with one VIT tank while literally cutting his damage in half. I made no attempt to pretend otherwise and was perfectly clear about how it was laid out. Obviously that's going to be different result than delving into your parse precisely. Then again, you're saying 4 minutes and 12 seconds, yet I see combat times extending to 4 minutes and 24 seconds. Since you're not being precise about your parse either, shall I claim "bad math" on you, or make an effort to follow your example as it was presented? Let us know.

And yes, you are simplifying things, like not including how much more often healers have to stop attacking to heal up tanks with smaller health pools (i.e. shorter time-till-death), leaving out damage dealt by the limit break, considering how other groups would perform (e.g. assuming the ratios of damage would be precisely the same). And I guess we'll just have to take your word on the timings, and never consider how often you've wiped on that encounter in the past (but might not have if the tanks had an additional 5000+ health each).

The problem with many of the pro-STR tank responses is they like to paint this picture where oodles and oodles of time is being saved during these encounters, and it's just not true. We are talking about seconds here on an encounter, and a few minutes across an entire dungeon. Your side uses phrases like "VIT tanks not performing to their full potential", and "VIT tanks holding their group back", or "the minimum health needed for a STR tank to survive". In truth the ONLY time extra damage from a tank truly matters is if your group can not beat an enrage timer without it. And even then we are talking about the tank buying the group a handful of seconds.. seconds that you should first try to scrape up through better group positioning, improving your groups cooldown management, telling DPS-Bob to stop slacking, etc. All of that should happen before a tank ever starts tossing a lot of health in favor of a little more damage.

And even then, it should be a temporary switch.. because eventually the other members of your group are going to be able to pick up the slack, and the tank's damage increase at the cost of his healthpool becomes no longer necessary outside of satisfying their epeen on a damage parse. Yay, you saved yourself 25 seconds, which you then turn around and wasted on looking up your DPS numbers.

The statement "the minimum health needed for a STR tank to survive" is funny because it assumes nothing ever goes wrong. It counts on every member of the team never making a misstep that requires the healer to take more attention off the tank than they otherwise should. And for as often as that can happen, having extra health on your side is not a bad thing. I will always prefer a little safety over a little speed when that speed is unnecessary for winning the encounter, because you can never claim with 100% certainty that the extra safety cushion is wasted 100% of the time.