Strength Tanks and You.

[Alexika]

stop calling vit tanks a hinderence , and bad players then :P

They are a hindeance. Look up the definition of the word.

If you really think 300 DPS compared to 700 makes no difference, let me show you this bridge.

[Kiteless]

They are a hindeance. Look up the definition of the word.

If you really think 300 DPS compared to 700 makes no difference, let me show you this bridge.

I was PUGing Ravana Ex yesterday, and ended up stuck with a co-tank full vit DRK who couldn't manage to do much more than spam Powerslash and put out 200 DPS even as OT (yes, you read that right, Powerslash while OT. It was... annoying). Of course, I had to take over as MT since the only thing he could tank was the floor, regardless of how pumped on vit he was. Made Ravana's DPS check phases an absolute pain in the ass for everyone else involved. Because not only could this guy not pass 200 DPS, I had to drop from 750 to 500 just to tank for him too. That's a massive amount of potential damage going to waste, and damage that matters, no matter who it comes from.

[Evaddaragon]

They are a hindeance. Look up the definition of the word.

If you really think 300 DPS compared to 700 makes no difference, let me show you this bridge.

You are suggesting that, changing all VIT and attribute points and going from tank stance to DPS stance more than doubles your DPS ? While still allowing you to hold aggro ?

Tanks stances take 20% of your damage down. A iLVL180 PLD would go from 640ish STR to 850ish STR.

Show me a parser, please. The math doesn't add up. Not denying it's a significant DPS increase, far from it. But more than double ?

[Alexika]

I was PUGing Ravana Ex yesterday, and ended up stuck with a co-tank full vit DRK who couldn't manage to do much more than spam Powerslash and put out 200 DPS even as OT. Of course, I had to take over as MT since the only thing he could tank was the floor, regardless of how pumped on vit he was.

The general populace of this game has zero understanding of effective hit points and max hit points. They think they are one and the same.

[Alexika]

You are suggesting that, changing all VIT and attribute points and going from tank stance to DPS stance more than doubles your DPS ? While still allowing you to hold aggro ?

Tanks stances take 20% of your damage down. A iLVL180 PLD would go from 640ish STR to 850ish STR.

Show me a parser, please. The math doesn't add up. Not denying it's a significant DPS increase, far from it. But more than double ?

All I see the VIT tanks doing for DPS is in the 300s. I am doing close to 700. That's real life experience, not dummy damage.

[Kiteless]

Yep, I can net around 450-500 DPS in my tank stance and 750-800 in my DPS stance, depending on the fight. And this is with 3str/2vit. And even then, I'd say that's usually more vit than I need.

[Stormrider]

I was PUGing Ravana Ex yesterday, and ended up stuck with a co-tank full vit DRK who couldn't manage to do much more than spam Powerslash and put out 200 DPS even as OT. Of course, I had to take over as MT since the only thing he could tank was the floor, regardless of how pumped on vit he was. Made Ravana's DPS check phases an absolute pain in the ass for everyone else involved.

So basically your example is a tank that for some reason could not stay alive could not hold hate. You don't see how silly it looks. Not sure about DRKs but they are a turtle tank like pld? But I am pretty sure PLD abilities that hold hate have little to do with dps and have built in hate mechanics. Unless I am missing something.

In fact I might even go so far as to say a PLD might be able to hold hate without doing any dps if he had unlimited MP? I am sure we have all lazily flashed and not bothered to target a trash mob that some dps is blowing all its cooldowns on, or thrown a provoke and a flash.

Will this help you beat an encounter when you are short 10%. No the extra dps squeezed out will be great. But I think we are talking about base tanking and pugging groups.

[Evaddaragon]

All I see the VIT tanks doing for DPS is in the 300s. I am doing close to 700. That's real life experience, not dummy damage.

And your main is... ? It says Bard on the left of your posts, but I'm aware that doesn't mean much.

It just doesn't add up when I look at the numbers. Had you have said maybe 500, that would make sense.

Even then, it's a significant increase in DPS. As for the whole debate, I've seen the pot calling the kettle, to put it politely.

There are merits to using STR accessories, not denying it. However, as I'm not in a static and do most things solo (did everything up to T11 pre-3.0), I simply cannot trust random PUG healers without giving as much margin for error as possible. I'd be doing otherwise with trusty healers, however. I do not think that makes me a bad tank for it, though.

[Alexika]

-snip-

You don't sound like you understand how threat works. DPS is the single largest factor in threat. I mean I can go hold threat without my tank stance up in any fight you want to name.

[Alexika]

And your main is... ? It says Bard on the left of your posts, but I'm aware that doesn't mean much.

My main is Warrior. Evandis Shieldheart, Sargatanas server.

I am on a PS4. I will reach out to the person who has the DPS results from the last Ravana EX I did, which included and all VIT/Parry built tank and me a full on STR tank. I can tell you right now the numbers were in the high 200s for him and 720 for me.