Oh, so FFXIV is pay-to-win? That's... stupid.

[Kaiser-Ace]

I think once I have my crafters and gatherers all up to 60 I'm going to make 5* items with nothing more than a little time as my mats will be nearly free. Then I'm gonna sell all my 5* craft goods for 500 Gil a pop just to piss you market board junkies off.

News flash, Vanity gear, Air Ship Parts, Chocobo Items, and Furniture are the only real market driving items and Materia Fluctuates to much to be a stable long term investment.

Extra retainers do give you the potential to make more Gil, but honestly what will you do with it? Housing plots? Furniture? Vanity/Alt Gear? Having a shit tone of Gil doesn't give you any edge over those of use who don't have it, you just get to have a few "Shiny Things" that we don't want/Can do with out until we can afford them. The only thing that required any real Gil Investment was Novus phase of the relic quest and even that could be done on the cheep if you went tri-stat.

[Aeyis]

snip

Well, actually...you can buy raid/ex primal clears (including their drops), with gil.
Or you know, a house.

One retainer is enough to make sure I dont have to gather certain hard to farm items (chimeric manes, skins). If I had 4 I could let them farm nearly all of the materials I need and I could produce 500k~ selling items nearly none-stop.

Argue about it not being pay to win if you want. But saying that retainers dont give an advantage over others is woefully naive.


Whether via inventory space (amount of items compared to inventory slots is very small compared to other mmos), or ventures; retainers give great advantages to those that have more of them.

[Kaiser-Ace]

Well, actually...you can buy raid/ex primal clears (including their drops), with gil.
Or you know, a house.

One retainer is enough to make sure I dont have to gather certain hard to farm items (chimeric manes, skins). If I had 4 I could let them farm nearly all of the materials I need and I could produce 500k~ selling items nearly none-stop.

Argue about it not being pay to win if you want. But saying that retainers dont give an advantage over others is woefully naive.


Whether via inventory space (amount of items compared to inventory slots is very small compared to other mmos), or ventures; retainers give great advantages to those that have more of them.

Sorry man, RNGsus says that Retainers don't reliably bring back anything. For every pot of Metallic Silver Dye my retainers bring I get 20 worthless fish. So it's definitely only playing Chaos Theory on sending 8 retainers out instead of 2. You may actually get a rare item that way, but the other 7 will bring back <Insert worthless common drop here> and that's assuming the 8th doesn't as well. There's no P2W and there's no reason other than a ridiculous amount of compulsive hording to end up filling up your retainers. If I need Iron I go get it. If I get allagan leather, I usually sell it since I can't use it yet tbh, but rare items that are not easy to come by are the ONLY craft items I don't dump to the NPCs after my crafting spree is over. If I can get more easily I don't keep it. So maybe being a DoW just makes me incapable of understanding "The Crafter's Plight" but I really don't get why inventory is such a damn issue to you guys. If you max out DoL (Like I am) then you can get low level mats any time you want/need them. Thus leaving no reason to hoard them. (All I gotta do for HQ animal skins for ex is go out side Ul'dah and slaughter mice until they drop, AoEs kill like 4-8 mobs at once out there)

[Aeyis]

Sorry man, RNGsus says that Retainers don't reliably bring back anything. For every pot of Metallic Silver Dye my retainers bring I get 20 worthless fish. So it's definitely only playing Chaos Theory on sending 8 retainers out instead of 2.

Thats because your sending them on the wrong kind of ventures. I never send my retainers on quick ventures unless im after untradable dyes.
They are a very poor means of getting gil.[/QUOTE]
RNG? There is no rng involved in retainers hunting/farming items. Unless you count nq/hq but you will be making these items into refined items anyway, so that matters little.In fact...retainers are more likely to bring HQ materials from hunts then you would if you killed the mobs yourself.


Easily get some skins yourself? I take it you havent farmed chimera manes then.

If you max out DoL (Like I am) then you can get low level mats any time you want/need them. Thus leaving no reason to hoard them. (All I gotta do for HQ animal skins for ex is go out side Ul'dah and slaughter mice until they drop, AoEs kill like 4-8 mobs at once out there)

I've maxed out my DoL. Which is to say, nearly fully pentamelded BiS level 60. Strangely I still dont have the time to farm several hundreds of low level items. Not when I could rather buy them from the mb and farm something that sells for 10x as much instead.


By the way, I removed nearly every single low level material from my retainers when HW hit. It was literally the first thing I did when I logged into the game when the maintenance for early access was finished.

Yet despite not having any culi items stocked (apart from the ones I need for 2x cp food) most of my retainers slots are still filled. (including my own inventory slots)


The reason why crafters (and other smart people) stock certain materials is because they take a lot of time to collect. Because of this the markets for these items are highly in flux.
People dont want to be forced to buy them at a premium because the item happens to be selling for a lot when they need it, so they stock it up when the item sells for little.
In the process they save millions when they do need the items.

If I get allagan leather, I usually sell it since I can't use it yet tbh

My friend got some of that earlier today. After laughing and noting how worthless it is when she mentioned selling it, I gave her some Dawnborne Aethersand to sell instead.
Quick ventures are not a great place to send your retainers if you arent after minions or dyes.

[Zorlinta]

Easily get some skins yourself? I take it you havent farmed chimera manes then.

Chimera manes are get much easier through desynth Hundred Fin. Around 12% of get one, and can be hq, using proper bait around 98% chance to get that fish, in 1 hour irl is a lot.

So if you knew how to get more efficiently an item you really not need the retainer do the work.

[Aeyis]

Chimera manes are get much easier through desynth Hundred Fin. Around 12% of get one, and can be hq, using proper bait around 98% chance to get that fish, in 1 hour irl is a lot.

So if you knew how to get more efficiently an item you really not need the retainer do the work.

You call having a fisher at 60 and culi desynth at high level efficiently? Well, thats an odd way of looking at it.
Very few people have fishing at max. Even less people have culi desynth.

On the other hand, getting 10 manes per hour when all it takes is a few clicks (you dont even need to be playing, you could do this while busy with other things), is quite efficient. These can be HQ as well, up to 100% of the 10 collected per hour.

I have currently got 300 manes in my inventory, 100 of which HQ; all of which collected by my retainer over the course of a few days. No grinding, no fishing, no desynthing required.

[Kaiser-Ace]

snip.

You still haven't explained WHY you keep so much useless crap. I do craft a little but it's mostly for self sufficiency. (That way for about 10 minutes of mat farming I can make an HQ item that SHOULD cost a 2k at most instead of paying 12k for the same item which is an hour's worth of dungeon grinding as a dps)

But you realize you ARE hording right? If you can not fit items you ABSOLUTELY NEED into you inventory slots then you are keeping things you don't need. Hoarders are hoarders and just like IRL there is no reasoning with them. You can make your 5-star 1.8 mil craft items with less than a full inventory (Vanity Items are THE big market and there's no point HQing a stateless glamour item) and there is no reason why you shouldn't. The mentality of "I may need it" is what gives SE 4 USD per month per extra retainer. Because no matter how you justify it hoarders are idiots that keep more than they need. If those chimera whatevers (No I've never seen them my highest level Crafter is lvl 20ish and I don't believe my lvl 50 fisher will pull a chimera out of silver tear lake anytime soon. And if he does I'll stop fishing there for good) are so valuable then keep them instead of the 999 HQ animal skins in your inventory. What you say and what you're apparently doing are polar opposites. (And for the record, Allagan Crafting Mats sell really well on balmung. I made almost 40k off of three items from T5 today alone) So stop BSing and start prioritizing.

[Radial]

You still haven't explained WHY you keep so much useless crap. I do craft a little but it's mostly for self sufficiency. (That way for about 10 minutes of mat farming I can make an HQ item that SHOULD cost a 2k at most instead of paying 12k for the same item which is an hour's worth of dungeon grinding as a dps)

But you realize you ARE hording right? If you can not fit items you ABSOLUTELY NEED into you inventory slots then you are keeping things you don't need. Hoarders are hoarders and just like IRL there is no reasoning with them. You can make your 5-star 1.8 mil craft items with less than a full inventory (Vanity Items are THE big market and there's no point HQing a stateless glamour item) and there is no reason why you shouldn't. The mentality of "I may need it" is what gives SE 4 USD per month per extra retainer. Because no matter how you justify it hoarders are idiots that keep more than they need. If those chimera whatevers (No I've never seen them my highest level Crafter is lvl 20ish and I don't believe my lvl 50 fisher will pull a chimera out of silver tear lake anytime soon. And if he does I'll stop fishing there for good) are so valuable then keep them instead of the 999 HQ animal skins in your inventory. What you say and what you're apparently doing are polar opposites. (And for the record, Allagan Crafting Mats sell really well on balmung. I made almost 40k off of three items from T5 today alone) So stop BSing and start prioritizing.

If keeping commonly used mats that can swing in price + or - up to 200% or more in a day on the MB is hoarding i don't want to be normal Honestly you sound like you don't have a clue about markets or basic economics and then admit to not having high level DoH/DoL and yet want to lecture us on "hoarding" and call us idiots for following basic smart sell/buying practices.....

PS: LOL at making 40k on MB so you must be an expert. 40k is nothing.

[Aeyis]

You still haven't explained WHY you keep so much useless crap.

I do believe I've mentioned the items I collect are not ''useless crap''

But you realize you ARE hording right?

I have no space to hoard. If I had 2 more retainers, only then would I consider collecting items just for the sake of collecting.

You can make your 5-star 1.8 mil craft items with less than a full inventory (Vanity Items are THE big market and there's no point HQing a stateless glamour item) and there is no reason why you shouldn't.

You only craft small time as you mentioned yourself.
The real money is in producing high level items (be they equipment or vanity) whenever the demand is present. For this you need to keep supplies. Whenever an item I've make sells I can replace it right away because I kept supplies of the materials.

What you say and what you're apparently doing are polar opposites.

It is?
It's pretty simple. I keep supplies of the items I will need. This includes one full retainer tab of (gathering and crafting only) materias, to give an example.

(And for the record, Allagan Crafting Mats sell really well on balmung. I made almost 40k off of three items from T5 today alone) So stop BSing and start prioritizing.

The 2 dawnborne Aethersand I gave my friend sell for 100-200k each (depending on the day). Prioritizing indeed. 13k for a single material is not exactly my defination of ''sell really well''
It goes without saying that selling prices differ per server. But I dont think 40k~ is a great price on anywhere outside of Gilgamesh.

[Rath]

I do believe I've mentioned the items I collect are not ''useless crap''

Material-wise what do you actually have filling your retainers? I am curious as I have all my crafts at 60 and have quite a bit of room, even holding all my randomly collected "junk" that I really won't ever use.