BRD/MCH look here

[Edellis]

Not as well as you think. The devs even threw in a 15sec cool down on GB when you turn it on or off. So stance dance is out of the question especially during your opener and during buff rotations. And with that cast time it throws a wrench in the way brds use to play. That's like adding cast times to drg and mnk it just wont fit.

What the....look if you were EVER trying to stance dance before this patch on BRD at intervals of 15 seconds, then i can understand why people are complaining about crappy DPS.

It throws a wrench in your playstyle if you're too stiff to learn a new trick, which is really all you're doing. I barely even notice my cast times anymore, it simply isn't that big a deal. In the end it really just comes down to players sucking and refusing to get better. If you were good at 2.0 bard and refuse to get good at 3.0 bard's mechanics, then you are just choosing to suck.

You ask for competitive DPS, to hang with the melees and casters, yet when they actually provide an avenue to make bridging that distance a bit less extreme, you guys roll on your back and start QQQQQQQQQQing about silly stuff. You want "GOOD DEEPS" but refuse to make a sacrifice for anything, in a class that's literally designed to sacrifice their damage for support abilities. I really don't see how you guys keep typing this crap.

BLM moves out of ley lines, doesn't pay attention to their MP bar, their DPS plummets. A boss changes phase and MNK has to work their DPS up all over again through multiple GCD rotations. But you expect to run circles around the boss, ignore AoE indicators, and still put out damage on their level?

[Astral145]

What the....look if you were EVER trying to stance dance before this patch on BRD at intervals of 15 seconds, then i can understand why people are complaining about crappy DPS.

lol I would love to see the devs add cast times to drg, nin and mnk. You would see rage haters 3 times it is now. Cast times changes the way a class plays. GB/WM does not make up for it. The dps is still horrible and the game play is no longer unique. Yes its nice to put on GB/WM with out a cast time but the core game play has drastically changed. Again it would be like mnk, nin and drg getting cast times it just doesn't fee right anymore. BRD and MCH lost its core game play with GB/WM.

[Edellis]

I really don't understand how MCH "lost its core" anything when it was released with gauss barrel...what are you even getting at here.

And, again, DRG and MNK don't need cast times, they have positionals, and buff timers, and they're melee, so their risk is inherently higher in most duties. There is no reason to.

BRD had zero risk in its playstyle. And honestly, it still doesn't. My cast times are still too low to get me hit with stuff, and i can just turn my stance off and continue DPS the moment i'm in a tight spot. And now, i don't even have to lose a GCD to turn it back on!

You are literally complaining only because you actually have to think about something more than your own DoT timers. This is why I stopped playing BRD at 2.0. It was boring.

[Jeckyl_Tesla]

lol I would love to see the devs add cast times to drg, nin and mnk. You would see rage haters 3 times it is now. Cast times changes the way a class plays. GB/WM does not make up for it. The dps is still horrible and the game play is no longer unique. Yes its nice to put on GB/WM with out a cast time but the core game play has drastically changed. Again it would be like mnk, nin and drg getting cast times it just doesn't fee right anymore. BRD and MCH lost its core game play with GB/WM.

There's already whiners from DRGs because the class is no longer easy as it was at the last patch of ARR, and is more complicated. The good DRGs? Rocking on and pulling ahead.

There's a huge difference between melee and a ranged class getting cast bars. You still have the ability to be incredibly mobile as a MCN/BRD, you just have to think ahead and have to actually to have a small amount of skill before being able to pull out that PHAT DEEPS.

We will never do as much damage as pure DPS classes, because we are a support class, according to the people who designed us and made this game. BRDs cried for more DPS, and you got it. Instead, now you have to actually git gud to do it.

If you can't handle it, play something else. But then again, if you struggle with dealing competitive damage as a BRD as it is, you have no hope for anything else.

[Intellion]

I think an easy and simple fix to restore Bards to their proper gameplay would be like this:

1.) Wanderer's Minuet - Now an attack buff that only boosts the power of your next weaponskill by 20%. After its usage, the buff goes on cooldown, much like the new Barrage.
2.) Empyreal Arrow and Iron Jaws - No changes to current potency, but now usable anytime.

Everything else can be kept the same. Yet, I can guarantee you that that would make Bards decent again while still sticking to their proper run-and-gun gameplay.

There's nothing wrong with run-and-gun ranged DPS. Bards were completely fair and balanced by 2.55, but SE tried to "fix" what wasn't even broken, so they only ended up breaking it. My fix would ensure though that Bards can retain their essence and still remain balanced enough that they won't out-damage casters or melee.

[Astral145]

I really don't understand how MCH "lost its core" anything when it was released with gauss barrel...what are you even getting at here.

Your point would be valid if GB was given to us at lvl 30. GB/WM is handed over at level 52. The game play is very different before GB/WM. You do not get a nice boost to damage with GB/WM. However you loose a lot of mobility which puts on the same page as blm. I main blm so I know the differences. Blms have procs and scathe to help to keep damage going while on the move. I can crit up to 1200+ with scathe and procs can crit up 2k+ while on the move (lvl 54 blm). Yet GB/WM gives hardly any dps gain but your mobility is now on par with blm. DPS doesn't add up.

[Edellis]

Your point would be valid if GB was given to us at lvl 30. GB/WM is handed over at level 52. The game play is very different before GB/WM.

...You seriously make this argument, and then use BLACK MAGE as an example?

The class that completely changed its rotation every 6 or so levels? And then AGAIN once they got Flare? And then they got got Ley Lines, enochian and a bunch of other crap and it happened even more? What are you even crying about at this point.

Also, incase you missed the memo during your adventure to lv30, and then 50, and then 60, BRD is not ever going to output damage like Black Mage because they have abilities like Foe and Ballad and Paeon that provide passive buffs to your party.



You seriously think classes like DRG, MNK, or BLM was going to get all this extra shit they have to deal with to maintain their new DPS rotations, and you were just going to get Empyreal Arrow, Sidewinder, and a 20% damage buff FOR FREE and do 10% less damage than them? While running around and ignoring mechanics like the spoony bard you are?

[SonTensei]

The changes are pretty much what i was looking for to be honest. The play style isn't quite the same as 2.x but the nice thing is that you can use both seamlessly now!

1. lots of crap flying around and you need to dodge part of a fight -- okay drop WM and 2.x bard it up

2. need to push dps and can stand around for a bit, okay put up WM and buff and bam.

Its not really that complicated. In fact if you ever played scholar its easier than SCH stance dancing, you dont need to worry about healing people.

[Astral145]

...You seriously make this argument, and then use BLACK MAGE as an example?

The class that completely changed its rotation every 6 or so levels? And then AGAIN once they got Flare? And then they got got Ley Lines, enochian and a bunch of other crap and it happened even more? What are you even crying about at this point.

Also, incase you missed the memo during your adventure to lv30, and then 50, and then 60, BRD is not ever going to output damage like Black Mage because they have abilities like Foe and Ballad and Paeon that provide passive buffs to your party.

yes I will make that argument because everything that BLM got did not change the core game play of the class in fact it improved the game play by giving more skills that builds up from the core game play. What BRDS and MCH got was equivalent to a gimp blm.

[Jeckyl_Tesla]

yes I will make that argument because everything that BLM got did not change the core game play of the class in fact it improved the game play by giving more skills that builds up from the core game play. What BRDS and MCH got was equivalent to a gimp blm.

You're never gonna DPS like a BLM, because you're #1, a support and require much less thought process than a BLM.