Bard Rant (ノಠ益ಠ)ノ彡┻━┻

[JohnMccain]

Its hard to not loose DPS while moving. Some people are using legacy mode while some don't. Also even while not using legacy I still had dps drops when moving even thought I was clearly moving around by strafing. The only way I've found to deal with this was to use the focus feature. So I wouldn't say you're not loosing dps everytime you move but from my experience you loose some.

This makes no sense. The only time you wouldn't get auto attacks in was if you were facing >~80 degrees if you drew a straight line from you to the target. If you strafe you will never miss any auto attacks. You can go test it out for yourself on a target dummy.

[pandabearcat]

SE simply marketted the skill wrong.

The idea is that you gain the equivalent (or close to) a caster's dps while in minuet.

You don't "lose" dps that you never had.

BRD were always worse off than other dps - this was accepted. That hasn't changed.

What did change was they were supposed to be similar in dps in minuet. So i really don't get what the complaint is, aside from the fact that minuet's dps increase is not enough to do what it was supposed to do.

Mechanicswise you have no basis for complaint. Other than "i don't like the way it plays". Which well, you can't really have it both ways. You cannot have a class that brings that kind of utility, AND movement, AND the same dps as other classes, why would you bring anything else? Damage, Mobility, Utility, pick 2.

[Tua]

I'll take the Mobility and Utility, thanks.

[pandabearcat]

I'll take the Mobility and Utility, thanks.

Then don't use minuet. Problem solved.

[Zyrusticae]

Mechanicswise you have no basis for complaint. Other than "i don't like the way it plays". Which well, you can't really have it both ways. You cannot have a class that brings that kind of utility, AND movement, AND the same dps as other classes, why would you bring anything else? Damage, Mobility, Utility, pick 2.

Except the job HAS to have damage because it fills a dps role.

DPS. Not support. Not support DPS. DPS.

DPS DPS DPS DPS DPS DPS DPS

I'll repeat this however many times I have to, because it just doesn't seem to get through so many peoples' incredibly thick skulls.

Bards are DPS job. Just like MCH is a DPS job, BLM is a DPS job, SMN is a DPS job, DRG is a DPS job, MNK is a DPS job, and NIN is a DPS job. There is zero excuse for this much of a discrepancy. Everything people keep spouting off are just excuses.

[Lyni]

Topic #33. Lets see how high we can get on threads about the exact same thing.

[Viar]

(Your math on Barrage is completely off. The old Barrage (tripple for those that didn't know how to quad) did 6 bonus AA's. Those that did know had to Quad Barrage were getting 8 bonus AA's out of it. The damage not being flashy doesn't mean it was lower. Quad barrage was worth roughly 800 potency where tripple was worth roughly 600. Your Empyrian Arrow is worth 2x240 or 480 potency with the new barrage 800>480, 600>480 too. It would work a bit different now with det nerf, but that doesn't mean that didn't translate into the new barrage vs old one as a nerf.)

Just like yours on the new Barrage... Barrage'd EA is 240 x 3 = 720 potency with x1.44 multiplier from traits and minuet.

[pandabearcat]

Except the job HAS to have damage because it fills a dps role.

DPS. Not support. Not support DPS. DPS.

DPS DPS DPS DPS DPS DPS DPS

I'll repeat this however many times I have to, because it just doesn't seem to get through so many peoples' incredibly thick skulls.

Bards are DPS job. Just like MCH is a DPS job, BLM is a DPS job, SMN is a DPS job, DRG is a DPS job, MNK is a DPS job, and NIN is a DPS job. There is zero excuse for this much of a discrepancy. Everything people keep spouting off are just excuses.

So you are a dps job, so you get to do dps, at the expense of your mobility.

I understand that minuet is not doing the damage it should be doing. I think that is being addressed. I simply do not understand the vehemence bards seem to have regarding this change however.

As I noted before, you are getting (supposedly) more dps. So you will be better off than you were in 2.5.

Do you want to keep all your songs and do the same dps as a BLM or SMN, and keep your mobility? I am simply stating that this is a fairly selfish point of view.

There must be some drawback, no?

You also seem to have misinterpreted my statement. I said pick two. It seems that the people in this thread overwhelmingly pick damage as "needed" like you said. I have no problem with this, this makes sense to me too. So either then you will have mobility or utility, or some gradient thereof. You cannot have both maximum mobility and maximum utility, and since it is unlikely they will nerf bard songs, you're stuck with losing your mobility in the form of minuet.

Do you have a better solution?

[Edellis]

Except the job HAS to have damage because it fills a dps role.

DPS. Not support. Not support DPS. DPS.

DPS DPS DPS DPS DPS DPS DPS

blah blah blah QQ QQ QQ salty dehydrating river of tears

You guys went 50 levels and hundreds of hours into 2.0's bard knowing you were DPS support before you even freaking capped the class, you went all of 2.0 endgame knowing this, you went from 50-60 knowing this as well and now you're still crying the same old song, pun so very much intended.

You always had damage, you still have utility even if you think it's irrelevant (spoiler: it isn't)

After we get patched you'll have even more damage, you'll still have utility

If you want to play 2.0 bard, you're going to either have to wait for a private server or turn off minuet and suffer the DPS hit

Whether or not the Barrage change was a buff or nerf is completely totally and utterly irrelevant, it was a mechanic change that was obviously intended to move the class into the position it's in now, along with greater scaling rewards on every stat in the game to affect weaponskills and NOT auto attacks.

Will this thread ever become productive? God it's like a broken record of redundant tears in here. YES, Minuet needs a bit of a damage boost. After that, bard will be a-ok.


As for every other complaint in here:

Damage, Mobility, Utility, pick 2.

/thread

I really don't like you, you made no points at all. All the people saying that it is unfair to be able to move and dps or that you should not be able to has nothing backing it. It is bad game design to have classes play pretty much the same. In other mmos there is a class that can move and do skills, and they are just fine. The fact people think you should not be able to do it is laughable at its best, it shows they are closed minded on game design.

Classes should be about play style choice. Range dps should be on par with each other, and will be from what devs are talking about. The fact they changed a class design around is the problem.

If you guys don't like that both jp and us community is trying to get it changed back. Too bad I guess. Play a caster.

1) tee hee deal with it

2) tell me more about your expertise in game design, better yet tell square, maybe they'll hire you or something, whoooo knowwsss

3) People who say we have no "PROOF" on why Ranged + Damage + Utility is a terrible idea, yeah, they clearly seem to forget that one calamity in FFXIV ARR's history where everyone was stacking BRD because there was literally no reason not to.

4) When...were we arguing to change it back? You can still play without minuet, silly dilly. The (real) objective is more favorable BRD DPS, not to throw hissy fits because you have a minor cast time on your abilities now.

[Snowaeth]

Just like yours on the new Barrage... Barrage'd EA is 240 x 3 = 720 potency with x1.44 multiplier from traits and minuet.

My math isn't wrong. You'r counting the basic hit which would have been there to begin with. Barrage only gives you 2 extra hits AND GUARANTEES THEY WON'T CRIT (old barrage did crit).
If you look at my math I'm counting 2 extra hits per barrage on old barrage not 3 otherwise with your math you could say tripple was 900 potency and quad was 1200 potency.

Having more crits also almost guaranteed crits on old Barrage where this one is guaranteed to not crit, thus your multiplier point is very moot.