Shots Fired: A Machinist Guide

[RiceisNice]

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Is wildfire before or after the buffs? If it's after the buffs, that's 3 seconds of wasted buff uptime that could've been applied to auto attacks and other shots. Not to mention that wildfire gets its defense calculated twice that the damage won't quite add up 1:1. (in otherwords, does the added wildfire damage make up for the loss of 3 seconds?)

And a bit unrelated ot the actual discussion, but I severely hate wildfire's application in some of these fights. During both Bis and Rav's vulnerbility phases (corona and liberations), they have a tendency to bugger off before wildfire triggers unless I use it early during my cooldown pops.

[Ephier]

I appologise if I'm breaking the discussion here, but how viable is Feint exactly ? I've seen some people suggesting Feint in some situations that I cannot quite understand.
I've been reading most of the things on the forum about MCH but I still wanted to clear that one out.

Ephier, what do you mean ''if rapid fire and ammo are down, feint'' ?

Typically you are mobile if you have procs, if you do not have any procs you can use rapid fire for 3 instant cast shots, and if you have no procs or rapid fire you can use feint.

I don't have too many problems with mobility and GB now that I'm used to it. It still gives a bit of a DPS loss due to loss of auto attacks, which is problem with it. No real point in using it outside of opener if it restricts your movement for a dps loss (or at the very least no gain).

I agree, in fights with no downtime GB after opener is bad, anything that would cause you to interrupt the cast would be a huge dps loss. Fights like bismark and ravana do have downtime to put it back on though and get a quick pew pew off and drop it again. The only reason I am even getting used to full time GB is just incase they make it worth while to use full time.

[SaintCartridge]

I see. Thank you Ephier!


RiceisNice I think wildfire has to be applied after the buffs.

You are right, we loose a couple of seconds in DPS. But its better to loose that, than to loose the Wildfire itself.
Cuz think about it, if you put wildifire first and buffs after, then you gonna go like, for example: split shot - blood for blood - slug shot - hawk eye - etc

While if you put buffs first and wildfire after, eventhough u loose some seconds on the buff, u make the most of the wildfire, for example: split shot - blank - slug shot - ressemble - etc

The thing is, you loose something in both cases, but if im not seeing things totally wrong, then I believe you DO have to put buffs up first.

[SaintCartridge]

Yes in that circunstance Tsilyi I totally agree with you!

But we can definitely confirm that, if Wildfire has a chance to go off, its always better to put buffs first then wildfire after, correct ?

[RiceisNice]

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Now that I think about it, you could just apply gauss then the buffs. Though I'm still iffy on the downtime for just that. I can see it working for burst damage on vulnerability phases (again which do exist like coronas or liberation), but outside of that it's really cumbersome and iffy with the defense calculations on wildfire.

[SaintCartridge]

Hmm true. Using Gauss + buffs into that vulnerability phases of ravana ex is when MCH dps is gonna shine indeed! And that is advised for pretty much 99% of the any other boss content still to come.
Unfortunately RiceisNice I can't discuss this matter further since I'm just gonna jump into Ravana Ex today for the first time (eventhough I've saw videos already).

In regard to wildfire, I do believe Ravana's jumps do mess up the ability alot, not allowing it to go off and I thank you for bringing that up cuz Im totally gonna be looking at that during the fight.
But if there's a chance for wildfire to go off when it has to go off, then I think we should always back it up with buffs first.

[RiceisNice]

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Ravana has a lot of vulnerability phases where he takes more damage, and I'd argue that MCH has one of the better burst damage game with GB. It's a matter of holding off your cooldowns for the liberation channeling and timing up everything so you can load off everything and get wildfire to trigger before he buggers off.

[Massterchef]

Actually, hard casting GB is not wasted DPS before Wildfire, as you can get off Ricochet + Gauss Round (total of 600 * 1.2 = 720 potency) as well as a buffed Head Graze/Blank and turn it off right after that is done, you lose out on 6 seconds with that period which is 200 potency (100 potency per 3 seconds for auto attacks).

You also lose out on 2 GCDs which under regular circumstances would be 2xsplit and AAs are around 80 potency so its 440potency. Plus popping GB before or after buffs will also cut into GCD/buff time so i'd say you actually lose 3 GCDs which is about 620 potency assuming its 2x split and a slug.

[Cascadi]

Where do you get that auto attacks are 100 potency? Not that they have a potency so to say but they do less than a 100 potency weaponskill such as an unbuffed Clean Shot. You can test it yourself. If you were to compare the dmg to a potency. It'd be close to 80 potency which is what your Rook Autoturret hits for.

It's 100 potency per 3 seconds depending on your auto attack delay. So if you have a Hive Musketoon which has an auto attack delay of 2.64, the potency of your auto attacks would roughly be:

Delay / 3.00 * 100 = Auto-Attack Potency
100 * 2.64 / 3 = 88 potency

[Cascadi]

You also lose out on 2 GCDs which under regular circumstances would be 2xsplit and AAs are around 80 potency so its 440potency. Plus popping GB before or after buffs will also cut into GCD/buff time so i'd say you actually lose 3 GCDs which is about 620 potency assuming its 2x split and a slug.

2/3 GCDs? Gauss Barrel cast time is 3 seconds, and if you use it right after a GCD (which is the best time to cast it) assuming a 2.3-2.4s GCD, you still only lose out on 1 GCD. Even if you did have Rapid Fire up, you'd lose out on 2 GCDs because 1.5s GCD, and since Rapid Fire isn't consumed by Gauss Barrel, you'd still be able to pull off buffed Split/Slug/Clean Shots as well as having access to Ricochet + Gauss Round which is still higher potency (1x split + slug + auto attack - 420 potency, 1x ricochet + gauss round - 600 * 1.2 = 720 potency)