Buff Bards or Riot

[KyteStones]

Armies aside, many individual archers were significantly more mobile than you might think. There are historical records of archers who wielded arrows in their bow hand so they could fire them more quickly, as well as many with quivers set to the side to make them easier, and faster to draw. There are also countless tales of archers who could loose 3 arrows in mere seconds.Actually, those exist. There have been plenty of people complaining about the rubbish BLM skills, because let's face it most of the BLM unique skills suck up to 50. That you haven't seen these threads says you simply haven't been looking or have seen it and are ignoring it to suit your arguments.

you show me anywhere on the first 5 pages of the general discussion section of a BLM complaint thread of these older useless skills. (considering these thread "should be" in their respective class threads not the general discussion but I digress.)

As for historical records, please show me these records where archers are jumping up and down, side to side spinning 360 degrees non stop firing arrows ALL hitting their target. Mind you, there is no stopping during this time until the fight is over.

Protip: you can't.

[Ransu]

yet 95% of people complainin about how bard is destroyed now are complaining about not being able to attack like used to while moving lolz

just to use an example some1 in the FC im in ranted and whined for good hour yesterday about how bard is utterly destroyed n not worth playing cause cant attack while moving .. wanna know the funny side of it?? his/her bard was level 51 so how would he/she know??

To be fair, you can't just drastically change a playstyle and expect the masses to be ok with it. If people wanted to have cast times and be rooted in place they would have leveled a BLM. WM to me just seems like nothing more than a way to homogenize the class in the poorest way possible.

[Intellion]

Here's the problem with these threads..you people (bards) are always jumping around running around shooting your arrows and never sitting still. This annoys me. You'd never see an archer do that (fantasy game or not). I think this is a good thing having your asses planted to the ground in order to fire your arrows efficiently instead of jumping around like you're all on PCP. If you don't like the move, don't use it.

You think I use all of my BLM spells? Like I cast freeze ever anymore. Oh wait, Lethargy? Useful on the slime in Syracus Tower and that's only to delay the slime long enough to kill. Apocostacsis? Yeah... MAYBE used once. It doesn't do that much for me to worry about.

I have plenty of moves that are useless and that I don't use. So where are my massive complaint threads about removing these useless skills and replacing them with more useful ones? Oh wait...there are none! Why? Because we learn to adapt to the class and make it better with out those useless moves.

As a Bard who has cleared all Coils and EX Primals in ARR, let me ask you one thing:

Do you even play Bard?

Because statements like the one you made would only come from someone who has never played the class and doesn't know how its core gameplay works.

So you say "good" Bards stay still like BLMs? Wrong.

Two words:

Repelling Shot.

If you truly knew how to play Bards, then you wouldn't need any explanations.

[KyteStones]

As a Bard who has cleared all Coils and EX Primals in ARR, let me ask you one thing:

Do you even play Bard?

Because statements like the one you made would only come from someone who has never played the class and doesn't know how its core gameplay works.

So you say "good" Bards stay still like BLMs? Wrong.

Two words:

Repelling Shot.

If you truly knew how to play Bards, then you wouldn't need any explanations.

Why don't you look up my character data on the Lodestone. I have played every class to 50 minus the Dark knight and the Machinist. Here's where you didn't read my post correctly.

My complaint was the nonsense of jumping around constantly and moving aroudn when it is really not needed. Not to mention while doing this I have see many times people taking unnecessary hits with lame excuses because they can't sit still. Why do you need to be jumping around all the time? Why do you need to be moving during every fight? I main as a caster and I move far less than a Bard. I'm a caster I know, but seemly i take less damage than a bard because I'm not running around blaming my camera turning me around into an AOE because I feel the need to run around and jump because "i can".

So yes I have played bard, and yes I have played the 60 bard, my wife's bard. I see no issue with the move at all other than its buff. Needs to be 10 to 15% for it to be worthwhile, but overall none of the new bard changes are class breaking where the entire class has gone down the crapper.

[Lemuria]

you show me anywhere on the first 5 pages of the general discussion section of a BLM complaint thread of these older useless skills. (considering these thread "should be" in their respective class threads not the general discussion but I digress.)

Why does it have to be recent to count? You think people will be complaining about WM in 2 years time? Considering those skills haven't been changed in a very long time, no one is going to ressurect a zombie thread to discuss it. The fact is, it HAS been brought up and people DID complain about it. Apocatastasis was updated as a result of these complaints. It now reduces the damage taken by magic rather than a flat elemental boost.

As for historical records, please show me these records where archers are jumping up and down, side to side spinning 360 degrees non stop firing arrows ALL hitting their target. Mind you, there is no stopping during this time until the fight is over.

Obviously, creative license is used here. If you wanted everything to be historically accurate, your Black Mage would be equipped with herbs and twigs and White Mage would be a triage nurse. How fun would that be?

So instead of just arguing for the sake of arguing, bringing up points which have no relevance to the topic at hand, give some good reasons why Bard needs to be rooted considering their damage is still nowhere close to a Black Mage's output and are now suffering the same casting restrictions.

[KyteStones]

So instead of just arguing for the sake of arguing, bringing up points which have no relevance to the topic at hand, give some good reasons why Bard needs to be rooted considering their damage is still nowhere close to a Black Mage's output and are now suffering the same casting restrictions.

I have yet to meet a bard that can out DPS my BLM, even pre-nerfs when the class was said to be "the highest DPS output class". Instead of throwing temper tantrums at a move that was added you people need to add alternative ideas. Somewhere in the creating of this class, there was testers who verified "hey this works and damn look at that damage. Looks good to me. Ship it out" So it's not like they do this and s ay "well to hell with it, we added new moves so good enough" Ask for alternative fixes instead of screaming "IT BROKEN FIX NAO PLOX OR IT DED"

Here's an alternative right now! "Each 15 seconds you're standing still with it active, increase the damage rate 2% while adding a 3% critical chance every 3 shots"?

Give solutions. You people will never get this class "fixed" by making rant threads. They see these, laugh at all of you, and ignore them.

[Intellion]

Why don't you look up my character data on the Lodestone. I have played every class to 50 minus the Dark knight and the Machinist. Here's where you didn't read my post correctly.

My complaint was the nonsense of jumping around constantly and moving aroudn when it is really not needed. Not to mention while doing this I have see many times people taking unnecessary hits with lame excuses because they can't sit still. Why do you need to be jumping around all the time? Why do you need to be moving during every fight? I main as a caster and I move far less than a Bard. I'm a caster I know, but seemly i take less damage than a bard because I'm not running around blaming my camera turning me around into an AOE because I feel the need to run around and jump because "i can".

So yes I have played bard, and yes I have played the 60 bard, my wife's bard. I see no issue with the move at all other than its buff. Needs to be 10 to 15% for it to be worthwhile, but overall none of the new bard changes are class breaking where the entire class has gone down the crapper.

If you truly knew how to play Bards, you wouldn't need to ask why movement and mobility is an INTERGRAL part of our gameplay, and why taking that away from us is pretty much like a kick in the face.

But since you don't seem to know, I guess I can explain. Just shows that having tried out/leveled the class doesn't automatically mean you know how to play it, unlike someone who has dedicated themselves on maining the class:


Bards need mobility for the following things:

1.) Weaving in Repelling Shot during openers or combos. Since the skill is only usable in melee range, we often need to move around to chase after bosses or to position ourselves so that we don't fall off cliffs or land in AoE attacks after the skill is used. After the skill repels us far away, we would also often need to move again to readjust our positions to anticipate incoming attacks, mechanics, etc.

2.) Handling mechanics. Due to our mobility, we are often relied on to handle some mechanics during raids. Hence, it's not uncommon to see Bards attacking while moving since we all want to maintain our DPS even while handling certain boss mechanics.

3.) Maintaing our DPS even while under fire. While most other classes would need to stop attacking to dodge, Bards can continue firing even during movement. Skilled Bards can even anticipate moves and start moving BEFORE the AoE attacks or telegraphs appear and safely evade the attack long before the attack even comes. Hence, it's also not uncommon to see skilled Bards moving a lot during battle for the reason above.

As you can see, MOBILITY AND UTILITY (songs) are the key components and mechanics of Bards, NOT raw DPS. Hell, I and other skilled Bards at my FC move a lot during battle, and we rarely get hit by attacks, so what's your point?


And you say that Bards should have their core gameplay taken away just because you were paired up with some random Bards who suck at dodging?

Well, perhaps BLM should be changed so that their spells only work at melee range because I've seen a ton of BLMs who kept dying at bosses since they just stood still far away from the boss, and hence couldn't dodge those wide-cone AoEs in time. Sure you still have cast times, and now your range is short, but as long as your spell damage is buffed by 10%, it should be fine, right? Right?

[Lemuria]

I have yet to meet a bard that can out DPS my BLM, even pre-nerfs when the class was said to be "the highest DPS output class".
...
Give solutions. You people will never get this class "fixed" by making rant threads. They see these, laugh at all of you, and ignore them.

So, first you prove my point by saying what I said back to me, then you flat out ignore previous posts in this thread which have done exactly that -- offer suggestions.

The main argument here is that the damage BONUS simply doesn't cover it. It needs to be significantly higher than it is to counter the loss of mobility and auto-attacks. Even a bonus of 30% would go a long way to counteracting the balancing issues, which was already suggested had you been paying attention.

So yes, these threads tend to be a bit of a rant but a rant with good reason. None of the other classes have had such a drastic change in their gameplay post-50, so it's only expected that people are going to be a little disgruntled. Especially given the damage doesn't even cover the costs.

[Misery1337]

Here's the problem with these threads..you people (bards) are always jumping around running around shooting your arrows and never sitting still. This annoys me. You'd never see an archer do that (fantasy game or not). I think this is a good thing having your asses planted to the ground in order to fire your arrows efficiently instead of jumping around like you're all on PCP. If you don't like the move, don't use it.

This guy has absolutely NO knowledge of the BRD playstyle, I'll go as far as to assume that he asked his wife to level his BRD for him or something. Any further reply to him would only decrease your IQ points so save your IQ points while you still can, ignore this troll and lets move on with the topic at hand.

[randysquirrel]

I'm a caster I know

Sorry you lost all credibility when you said you've only ever used apoc once. Doesn't sound like you know BLM that well, yet here you are commenting on BRD