XI-2 was released this past September, or didn't you notice?

[sruon]

Trust me, if this game wants to survive, FFXI is the last MMO it should draw ideas from.

[Andrien]

I still play FFXI, and have been for 7 years. This is not FFXI-2. lore wise

Surprised this thread not locked yet

[SniperRifle]

if u like ffxi so much y dont u marry it?

It's cool. I agree w/ you OP. I had my own recent blow out on these forums. This place is retarded. Sometimes I wish I just got permabanned so I wouldn't have the option of lurking.

[whoopeeragon]

DIFFERENT WORLD?! -Different names, you mean?

Thanalan: a.k.a. Meriphataud Mountains

La Noscea: a.k.a. Rolanberry Fields next to the ocean

The Black Shroud: a.k.a. A greener, crappier version of Sanctuary of Zi'Tah

Coerthas: a.k.a. Lufaise Meadows, Konschtat Highlands, Misareaux Coast -take your pick

Mor Dhona: Looks a hell of a lot like many of the Aht Urghan expansion areas (Mount Zhayolm, and some of the Assault areas, etc.).


The races are IDENTICAL -minus a tale on the Roegadyn (Galka). I don't even know why I would acknowledge such an ignorant claim, anyway. I've indulged you long enough. FFXIV has more in common with FFXI than any 5 FF titles have in common with another. Don't kid yourself.

Very well. By your same standards, FFXIV could potentially be a FFXII-2, since Thanalan is very close to the Dalmasca Estersand and Westersand. Or perhaps a FFX-3, since it is very similar to Bikanel Island deserts. Or how the Black Shroud bears similarities to Kilika forest, therefore, FFXIV should be renamed FFX-3. Oh wait, Balamb fields was next to an ocean as well. Therefore, as La Noscea bears similarities to Balamb fields, FFXIV should be renamed FFVIII. Oh no, Coerthas seems to resemble the Archytle Steppe! Therefore, this should be a FFXIII-3! But wait, Mor Dhona resembles Dream's End mashed with Mushroom Rock, so it's closer to a FFX-3!!!

So what should FFXIV be? FFX-3? FFXII-2? FFXIII-3? FFVIII-2? Take your pick.

Races are identical in structure and physical appeal, yes. But in terms of lore? Gender? We already have 3 more genders confirmed, and there is a new race already. And more are to come. Are you saying that, to turn this into a FFXI-2, let us scrap the new class (I don't know the name, the one with horns) and remove all future races which we can have, remove the genders which have been confirmed, continue making Miqo'te females the powerhouse of their race, and make Roegadyns start reincarnating? No thanks.

And by your same logic, why not have named Final Fantasy Tactics A2 into FFXII-2? It has the same races, landscapes and lore. It even had the same bloody characters.

Face it, there are similarities among areas throughout the entire FF series. Because FFXI just happens to share plenty of them, through, may I say, EXPANSIONS which heavily decrease the originality of which future games, especially MMO's, can produce since those ideas most likely have been taken, I'm sure you can potentially see through the similarities. Besides, the only similarities which you have produced which are limited to FFXI are only PHYSICAL. Nothing in terms of the game mechanics is overly unique to both FFXI or FFXIV throughout the FF series, and there are some in which FFXIV is purely unique in.

There are differences; our battles and armoury system should be a glaring drive-through into that. We have the market wards; I don't think that there are retainers standing around Jeuno waiting for someone to poke them. FFXI had 6 basic jobs, 3 mage, and 3 melee. FFXIV has 7 basic classes, 2 mage, 5 melee. We have the Battle Regimen, which allows for additional benefits from party members attacking at the same time. We can incapacitate our enemies, doing additional damages to various part of an enemy's body. Guildleves are also a different concept which separates the daily grind of FFXI into open-world instances in FFXIV.

The lore, mythology and context are different; FFXI was set in a more medieval time span, with a mix of folk areas and out-of-this world places which require more people to study alienism as treatment for some mental damage, while FFXIV is set in a more modern environment, with technology much more rampant and magic not being overly the focus. The beastmen have totally different story to them; instead of being the opposite of the 5 races, created to torment the races of FFXI, they instead where already present in Eorzea, and merely worship their own primal. Primals are also different, being the essence of the energy in the crystals instead being the 'sleeping gods' as they were in Vana'diel.

And one thing, Khal. You mentioned you didn't like the armoury system because it lacked job uniqueness, and you also disliked the fast-pacing of the battles. Is it really necessary to change these things to the way FFXI was in order to suit your preferences?

No.

People have different likes and dislikes, and I happen to like the fast-paced battles as well as the option to pick and choose abilities I desire to be on my class. I'm sure I'm not the only one in this boat, but that's what makes this game appealing to us...or me at least. I like the armoury system, and the choice of freedom around our classes. And if you haven't noticed already, there have been several new measure to create class uniqueness. Conjurer and Thaumaturge are two glaring examples; Raise and Rebirth etc on Conjurer, the insane damage boost to Thaumaturge. And to further increase uniqueness, we have the job system coming in.

Battles too fast? Nothing we can do about that. You surely must have hated FFXIII then for having battles with target times of 10 seconds or something like that. I kind of like this face-paced battle; and it's NOT as spammy as you think it is.

So, basically the message I'm trying to get to you across; not everyone wants a new FFXI. Sure, we can take certain aspects from FFXI, but we also took aspects from other games. Why not name this game Final Fantasy World of Diablo XI + III - 3? That's ok; taking the good parts of a game and putting them into a new one is fine. But renaming it and turning it into a sequel numbered entry is taking it too far. This game, in my eyes, is never a XI-2, and never will be. It will draw elements from FFXI due to it being the only lasting MMO SE have done, and I expect it to draw elements from past Final Fantasy games to live up to it's FF title. But I also expect it to be original in it's execution (which it has to an extent) and unique when it rises to a polish (which it is in the process of).

Sorry for wall of post, and apologies to anyone I may have offended.

Oh and....

Wanna know something else? The majority of the changes that have been made were inspired by the FFXI crew, and Yoshi-P's genius. So, stop being close-minded, and acknowledge the obvious fact: XI was great; XIV can be better, but it needs to draw off of XI in order to do so.

The person who kind of threw FFXIV into the mess it was now was the creator of FFXI, and some members of the old team before it got restructure also came from FFXI. So I wouldn't say that the changes would have been all totally inspired by the FFXI crew. I've noticed that a few of the FFXII staff have crept in as well.

[Lycanthroat]

the initial argument as posted by the OP wasn't that terrible....
the pages that piled up though was .

so instead of staying on topic and trying to convince you of something , which is as i see pointless i ll just ask the OP 2 important off-topic questions.

1. Why in hell do u censor the word "god" in "god damn" ?
and most important
2 . From all characters in a brilliant book and tv series which is the "Game of Thrones" why did you pick the dumper piece of dirt of them all? Khal Drogo had the most *SPOILER ALERT* embarrassing death in fantasy fiction history and yet you chose him as your forum name. WHY?

[Nel_Celestine]

I played XI from PC release until XIV release. While there are many things from XI i'd like to see in XIV I have to bring up that it is not the same game. They can draw aspects. Tidbits if you will. But for people who want an /Exact Copy/ of XI pasted onto this game I say to you, Please don't force that upon us. Yes suggest things you loved from the game, there is nothing wrong with that. But to want the same game over again is a bit much and hurts the creativity of the development team to give us NEW content and NEW ideas.

[AngryNixon]

I think it needs to "draw" certains things that worked in XI but not the entire game IE LINKSHELL ADMIN TOOLS AND /LSMES, PLAYER HOUSING, MAIL SYSTEM. Where is this stuff at???? should have been in the game before release...

This right here is the important point missing from the discussion. It seems mostly centered around the superficial similarities between the games. The characters being near identical, the zones being vaguely reminiscent, and any other similarities don't matter because what's similar is the veneer, not the wood beneath. Sure it was kind of lazy to "interpret" visual elements from FFXI and place them in a newly named redrawn world, but that's not the problem (nor does it ultimately matter, it's just window dressing). The issue lies in SE's failure to learn or "draw from", as Coombah stated, and implement the elements in FFXI (or other games) that were important core features, like a mail system or LS management tools for instance.

Their complete failure to bring in neutral elements that have nothing to do with FFXI, but that they implemented in and used successfully for years in FFXI (like mail systems) is where the main problem is. The accusation should not be that they copied from previous successes and that people should admit that they copied previous work, it's that they failed to copy the items of substance. It's like copying off of someone's test (who you know generally does really well on tests) and copying their name and the doodle they did in the margins of the page but none of the answers.

[Geesus]

Their complete failure to bring in neutral elements that have nothing to do with FFXI, but that they implemented in and used successfully for years in FFXI (like mail systems) is where the main problem is. The accusation should not be that they copied from previous successes and that people should admit that they copied previous work, it's that they failed to copy the items of substance. It's like copying off of someone's test (who you know generally does really well on tests) and copying their name and the doodle they did in the margins of the page but none of the answers.

I think this sums it up nicely. I have said things similar to this. If SE had of looked at the FFXIAH.com forums when they actually announced another MMO they wouldn't have screwed this up. Why? Well, Who do you think they are taking advice from now in regards to fixing their "new" game? The players. A majority of the SAME players speaking and brainstorming and TELLING SE what they did and didn't like in XI. How to improve it in a new MMO. How to make it feel new.

As for people fussing about Chocobos and Airships, Toss off. So many FF games have had Chocobos and or air ships so wtf does it matter if we would like to see them HERE!? Airships I could care less about personally but the extra content, you know, what's MISSING in this game, with raising a chocobo was fun. If you didn't do it well fine. I did multiple times and while it could be a PITA, it was still something I could do if I didn't want to do anything else in game.

As for story here, imho, it SUCKED when game launched. It was boring and uneventful. Now, not sure if this was just for the Limsa side as I did Ul'Dah just this weekend on a new character and found it more exciting BUT, this all could have been added to the patches that have rolled out since this spring. So there's another thing SE didn't do correctly at launch and they had EIGHT YEARS to get it right when they started thinking about and developing Crystal Engine and "Rapure".

There's more but I'm tired of beating this dead dog to the point, there's nothing to poke a stick at anymore. Many others had great posts in regards to these things mentioned and others not but those are my thoughts.

[Jennestia]

Oh yeah, they used swords in XI didn't they?
I see the connection now.

-Races
-HomePoint system (in this concept)
-Storyline Flow
-Progression Flow
-Primal Concept
-Primal Battle concept
-Dungeon Concept
-Upcoming job system
-Crafting changes

Need I go on?

[Geesus]

-Races
-HomePoint system (in this concept)
-Storyline Flow
-Progression Flow
-Primal Concept
-Primal Battle concept
-Dungeon Concept
-Upcoming job system
-Crafting changes

Need I go on?

You mean all the stuff in a normal MMO? O.o

lol