Thank you for the crafting changes

[Zangetsu]

Why are they putting an iron ingot in something that never used iron before? That's retarded. Are they getting rid of buckles or something? I hate these changes... they're dumbing down the recipes for stupid people.

Copper ingot you mean? In the hempen doublet vest instead of making parts(copper buckle) they have the general metal used. Hence simplify. Keep in mind the 2 recipes they gave us for the example is not the same item. It was a general idea of what we will see changed.

[Hawklaser]

Most of the people commenting about not liking the changes is not because changes were not needed, it is more because the changes seem to be closer to a sledgehammer approach than a scalpel.

The issues people are worried about are will there become large gaps in the rank up process, what will happen to the DoL and other gathering related concerns. Those are the two main ones.

Many agree adjustments are needed, but not all agree with the scale of the change.

I would prefer to see smaller steps taken first. Like with the recipe in the OP, my first question about it would be if the following portions of it are used in multiple synths or just the one?
1 hempen doublet front
1 hempen doublet back
1 pair of sheepskin shoulder guards (taupe)
1 pair of hempen sleeves

Now if they are only used in the one synth, then something needs to be adjusted. Whether that be consolidation of similar parts from multiple recipes becoming one part, or changing the materials to something more common. As an example, the hempen doublet parts, and even various other hempen fronts and back, could be simplified into one item called hempen clothes half. Leading to that portion of the recipe being changed to 2x hempen clothes halves. What this would accomplish is the removal of overly specific parts by condensing them into a more generic one. Part of what is fueling the need to simplify crafting is the limit on how many items one can put on their retainer to sell, coupled with way to many overly specific parts.

From just the one recipe, it is hard to tell exactly how things are being changed in general. They may very well be doing smaller adjustments, but the example recipe shows a very significant change. If had a few more sample recipe changes, might be easier to gauge the scale of the recipe changes. If all get changed to being that simple, it takes out part of what helps set FFXIV's crafting apart from your generic crafting system.

[Pyrix]

If they dumb it down I'm gonna be bitching about it A LOT in the forums come patch day.

[darkstarpoet1]

Most of the people commenting about not liking the changes is not because changes were not needed, it is more because the changes seem to be closer to a sledgehammer approach than a scalpel.

The issues people are worried about are will there become large gaps in the rank up process, what will happen to the DoL and other gathering related concerns. Those are the two main ones.

Many agree adjustments are needed, but not all agree with the scale of the change.

I would prefer to see smaller steps taken first. Like with the recipe in the OP, my first question about it would be if the following portions of it are used in multiple synths or just the one?
1 hempen doublet front
1 hempen doublet back
1 pair of sheepskin shoulder guards (taupe)
1 pair of hempen sleeves

Now if they are only used in the one synth, then something needs to be adjusted. Whether that be consolidation of similar parts from multiple recipes becoming one part, or changing the materials to something more common. As an example, the hempen doublet parts, and even various other hempen fronts and back, could be simplified into one item called hempen clothes half. Leading to that portion of the recipe being changed to 2x hempen clothes halves. What this would accomplish is the removal of overly specific parts by condensing them into a more generic one. Part of what is fueling the need to simplify crafting is the limit on how many items one can put on their retainer to sell, coupled with way to many overly specific parts.

From just the one recipe, it is hard to tell exactly how things are being changed in general. They may very well be doing smaller adjustments, but the example recipe shows a very significant change. If had a few more sample recipe changes, might be easier to gauge the scale of the recipe changes. If all get changed to being that simple, it takes out part of what helps set FFXIV's crafting apart from your generic crafting system.

this is the type of change i would have liked to have seen. if you are making any type of hempen clothing for example you would have generic parts for them that would be a common item. hempen clothing halves or fronts/backs if you want to call them that. this would have put someone constantly selling those halves because they were a common part. now the specific item could use extra parts for the craft, but they should be parts for that craft or commonly used items from other crafts.

example
hempen clothing half x2 (would be common item for all hempen clothing)
hempen yarn(item in range for the craft)
bronze buckle(buckles are commonly used items and low level to match the finished gear)

this type of streamlining would have not frustrated the crafters down because it allowed the level of the synth to match the level of the items required.

the only synths i hate is like a r27 hammer that needs a hammer head that requires a r40 crafter to make, but i can assemble at r21. the parts for the finished item should not require 20+ ranks above it on another class to make a part for. to me the parts for an item should all be close to the rank of the final synth or below.

i just feel instead of streamlining anything he took a hatchet to the system that myself and others enjoy more than battle in the game. i got more a feeling of accomplishment when i capped my first craft than i did any battle class. these type of changes are leading to nothing more than a less enjoyable system when this was one of the few things that made xiv unique and stand out from other games.

[Gramul]

I guess I'm caught on the fence with this whole ease of use vs involvement thing.
On one hand, gear will no longer take ages to make just to be replaced on the next level, but on the other hand, there's a sort of great satisfaction one gets from making gear out of its parts made from base pieces.

[Esk]

Yes It's great its still the same system, that takes ages to level and is a clicifest, with a bad UI and no poorly designed recipe book. But at least now it has a lot less depth, is much easier and we'll have lots more retainers space!

Now if we can just get them to remove all those weapon skills and let us just chose between attack/defend/WS in combat....

Edit:
Sorry, But yeah I'll still hold to my view that a better way would be:

- Recipe book (with a good interface to show components needed and how to make them)
- Faster more fun crafting interface**
- Reuse of low level components in New Hi rank gear
- Streamlining and small reduction in the number of components
- The edition of the dye system they mentioned.
- Rebalancing of item component Levels.
- Huge improvements to the wards system (or the move to a AH)

**
Components take 2-4 success (dependent on size/type) though all leveles
HQ'ing an item is done after this, allowing mass production and quality crafting to be split so the masses don't need to worry (can still occasional get a random HQ in production)
R01-20 Items (average sucess needed to complete a synth 3)
R21-40 Items (average needed to complete a synth 5/6)
R40-50 Items ( Current system basically )

[Starplayer]

Please, Please don't remove the facilities and treatise! I actually like the idea that you could specialize in different aspects of your craft. Using guild marks to improve your skills in different departments of your craft was a brilliant idea, imho, it added much more depth to the crafting system without making it confusing. There was nothing confusing about that part of the system, so why remove it?

[MariyaShidou]

I'm eagerly awaiting the response of these people who are like "coolbeans I wanna start crafting with these changes!", after they find out they still have click to 10 Standard for a synth, 300 synth for a level. I bet you will like it!

And while at it, the more than half a year promised recipe book is still missing.

[Ashaylin]

I'm all for streamlining if it will make crafting more efficient.

tedious =/= smart

Oh, I don't know. I'm sure there's some higher brain functioning involved in twitching your finger repeatedly. Never take your motor skills for granted! I know I don't.

I'll wait for the changes to be implemented to decide how ham-handed or intricate the fixes truly are, since it seems like the changes to crafting will be ongoing. People can boast about their cranial sizes as much as they want. I'm more interested in how these changes will effect the economy in regards to supply and demand.

[SnowTiger]

/bandwagon

Yeah I'm all for it. Don't get me wrong, I do love an in depth crafting system... But being in depth, and being overly complicated just for the sake of it are totally different. All the parts and junk were just a nuisance.

Like, especially with the multiple colors... I like being a crafter.. I like to make things for people on request, and barring certain high priced stuff, I like to do it with my own mats at no charge...

But that QUICKLY turns into a complete NIGHTMARE when the system is the way it is now. Oh, you want this set of gear? Well sure, let me just dip into this cluster**** of mats I have that eat up like 500 inventory slots, so I can get that lvl 10 set of gear made for you. It'll take about an hour or two. Oh darn, I need nails for these cloth items. Welp, none for sale and nobody on to make them... Better go level armorsmith, because all good tailors run a god damned FORGE in their TAILOR SHOP... GRRRR. >

Yeah, it was just flat out annoying at times. Again though, I do love a craft system with depth, and the last thing I would ever want for this game is a craft system like a lot of other WoW style MMO's have. I'd probably quit over that actually... But we're not looking at that, we're looking at a more FFXI style craft system, at least recipe wise, which imo, is absolutely great. <3

So yeah... /bandwagon all the way baby. :3