Extrem undercutting?

[ZephyrZ]

Can't talk about low level markets, but i got tired of seeing all the new 4 star crafters trying to make money in markets i control, so i and other crafters on our server collapsed the 4 star market to the point where making HQ yields a max of 100k profit after tax or even a loss. I don't lose any money doing it, it is just a way for me to ensure that i stay on top and keep others down. We are a group of crafters that like our position of being on top and don't need randoms infringing on our profits just before the expansion that got everything after nerfs. Git gud or git lost.

EDIT: Silly forum limits on posting -.- TL;DR It was a joke, don't get bent out of shape.

I think you confused coordinated croneyism and price fixing by established crafters, to prevent emerging crafters from succeeding in the marketplace as "getting good". Without your network of "colleagues" continually attempting to foil the genuine efforts of others, the emerging crafters would be just as good as you. You are intentionally making the playing ground uneven and in your favor, much like established corporations do to smaller marketplaces IRL. I.E. Walmart.


To each their own, however.

That was a joke, there is no collaboration of crafters, at least not on my server. We're always competing with each other with no cooperation in mind lol. But from a serious point of view, why should i let someone who is desperate for profits infringe on mine? Not just desperate but they got everything post nerfs, plz. Back on point, it's more of come in and match my price and i have no issue, i see you undercut me by 1 gil. I'll start undercutting by 100k each time. Buy me out, i'll make 3 more and list em at the same price, repeat.

Now THAT is harassment.

Within the rules of the game, but yah. Shadowy cabals controlling the marketboard is about as dickish as it gets.

It was a joke but even if it were true it would be within the rules of the game, undercutting someone isn't an offense. You would have to prove actual intent and you can't do that with undercutting which is why i thought the OP calling it "harassment" was too jokes. Also, remove the curse word from your post or risk getting pema banned, people have been for a lot less.

lol that's so mean but understandable.. right before an expansion, so many people trying to get in the crafting game to grab a slice of the pie once expansion hits.. It's time to go on lock down.

No planned conspiracy lol, it kind of just happened on my server. I don't know if it happened on others as well. Too many people tried to get in on the pie, a lot of them produce nothing but nq ugh. Here is what happened to the Wootz market as an example. For about a month, one person was buying all of the wootz ore and allagan wootz ore at 2k and 20k a piece; the armors and weapons were at 2.5 and 3.5 respectively. I never crafted wootz even though it had around a 1.5 to 2mil profit per craft, too much to do, too little time. Back to the point, so many randoms entered the market that the guy dried up the supply of mats, didn't matter if it came out at 100k now for the allagan wootz ore; he still bought it. Not only that but he made 5 of each wootz piece and listed it at 1.5mil instead of the 2.5, as time passed. he dropped that even further down to 800k. Wootz gear is now stable at 800k and has been for the last month, on the other hand, allagan wootz ore alone sells for 100k. Giving a less than 100k profit or even a potential loss even on hq crafts. I find it understandable as well and don't really see an issue with it, people need to learn how to think strategically, too many ppl have no idea what they are doing and just run a rotation they found online hoping it "works".

[m3eansean]

Git gud or git lost.

I think you confused coordinated croneyism and price fixing by established crafters, to prevent emerging crafters from succeeding in the marketplace as "getting good". Without your network of "colleagues" continually attempting to foil the genuine efforts of others, the emerging crafters would be just as good as you. You are intentionally making the playing ground uneven and in your favor, much like established corporations do to smaller marketplaces IRL. I.E. Walmart.

To each their own, however.

[GenJoe]

so i and other crafters on our server collapsed the 4 star market to the point where making HQ yields a max of 100k profit after tax or even a loss.

lol that's so mean but understandable.. right before an expansion, so many people trying to get in the crafting game to grab a slice of the pie once expansion hits.. It's time to go on lock down.

[Bombast]

Can't talk about low level markets, but i got tired of seeing all the new 4 star crafters trying to make money in markets i control, so i and other crafters on our server collapsed the 4 star market to the point where making HQ yields a max of 100k profit after tax or even a loss. I don't lose any money doing it, it is just a way for me to ensure that i stay on top and keep others down. We are a group of crafters that like our position of being on top and don't need randoms infringing on our profits just before the expansion that got everything after nerfs. Git gud or git lost.

Now THAT is harassment.

Within the rules of the game, but yah. Shadowy cabals controlling the marketboard is about as dickish as it gets.

[Kaiser-Ace]

Me personally, on Balmung Server I single handedly crashed the Market for any Accuracy Materia below rank 4. And I intend to do the same with all others.

There is no reason ANY single items should cost 400k+. That's just insane. So all you balmung players out there, I'm the reason your Rank 3 Accuracy Materia is now worthless. Thank you.
<Ports out>

[m3eansean]

There is no reason ANY single items should cost 400k+. That's just insane. <Ports out>

Chris - I see you have no crafting or gathering classes to 50 and as such, have no idea the amount of time and effort required to gather materials needed to make high end crafting goods. There is a very good reason why things can reach over 400k, largely due to the effort involved in gathering the materials needed (fishing windows anyone?). Not to mention in order to gather and craft most high end things, you need to be completely overmelded on your gear, which takes again significant time and effort.

[GenJoe]

Chris - I see you have no crafting or gathering classes to 50 and as such, have no idea the amount of time and effort required to gather materials needed to make high end crafting goods. There is a very good reason why things can reach over 400k, largely due to the effort involved in gathering the materials needed (fishing windows anyone?). Not to mention in order to gather and craft most high end things, you need to be completely overmelded on your gear, which takes again significant time and effort.

Nah that only justifies the base mats costing so much, it still doesn't explain the 1m+ profit margin on a finished product.

i.e. I can, at this moment, literally make Inferno weapons and make a 3m+ profit on each one easily.. It's not really hard to make one either, but the lack of crafters willing to take on the project has it so that on Jenova at least, there are only 2 people on MB that make and sell Inferno weapons..

On a less extreme, but more prevalent side of things, forager's and artisan's gear all have about 1m+ profit on it, on Jenova. There's really no other argument to make for that other than, because people will buy it at that price point.


Same goes for materia, people are so afraid of RNG they don't ever try to tackle the RNG problem by mass producing.. Afraid of getting 1 tier IV out of 50 converts? Do 500, 5000, 50000, and the number will eventually start to show a pattern close to the standard value.. and yet, people try spiritbonding 2 sets of gear, end up with no tier IVs and determine that tier IIIs should still make profit for them, otherwise they'd be LOSING money. That mindset sets in, and causes people to overprice their item because they're afraid of losing money. Which is fine and dandy, just don't get mad at me for undercutting by a large amount because I know my margin of profit better (due to larger number of data samples).

[m3eansean]

Snip

Those crafted items in turn require leveling almost every other craft up to 50, which is a huge time sink and investment. Since time can't be quantified a value easily, it's understandable to see that some feel the time spent getting to the point to make these 3 and 4 star items is equivalent to a 1million gil profit margin. Also the system is 100% free market, so it will only bear the cost of any item that consumers are willing to pay. The only reason there is the 1million gil profit margin is because we can assume the consumers feel this is a "fair" price for the item. If they dont, the item stagnates and sits on the board for days and eventually gets knocked down in price.

[GenJoe]

Those crafted items in turn require leveling almost every other craft up to 50, which is a huge time sink and investment. Since time can't be quantified a value easily, it's understandable to see that some feel the time spent getting to the point to make these 3 and 4 star items is equivalent to a 1million gil profit margin. Also the system is 100% free market, so it will only bear the cost of any item that consumers are willing to pay. The only reason there is the 1million gil profit margin is because we can assume the consumers feel this is a "fair" price for the item. If they dont, the item stagnates and sits on the board for days and eventually gets knocked down in price.

You're just repeating what I said :P Except, I emphasize your latter point.. People charge that much because people PAY that much, I don't think there are too many crafters who think that the time and effort they put in is worth THAT much profit, consumers feel like it is though.

Because, the items are produced by 4 star crafters and bought by 2 star crafters.
As a 4 star crafter, you know how ridiculously easy it is to make said gear, you know how little risk there is involved in making it hq, But as a 2 star crafter, you're in the dark about the apparent "difficulty" and "RNG" so you're willing to shell out the money. It's the norm, so it seems somewhat justified, and justified it is, no need to explain your price in a free market.

I don't personally agree with Kaiser's point of view, if there's profit to be made, I'll go for it. I may crash the market but it's not for a noble cause like he stated, it would mainly be to drive out the competitor and piss them off. But he has a valid point, there is too much bloat on the MB prices. I make sure to take plenty advantage of it while I can though..

[Bombast]

Me personally, on Balmung Server I single handedly crashed the Market for any Accuracy Materia below rank 4. And I intend to do the same with all others.

There is no reason ANY single items should cost 400k+. That's just insane. So all you balmung players out there, I'm the reason your Rank 3 Accuracy Materia is now worthless. Thank you.
<Ports out>

Hardly. Heavens Eye has fluctuated heavily since Alexandrite first appeared. I have doubts that you have had a significant impact, particularly on Balmung.

But sure, keep telling yourself that.