selling coil runs and primals

[GenJoe]

snip

You're missing the point entirely. It's not an argument against run-selling it's about the consequences of it..

Some teenagers do chores like mowing the lawn, shoveling snow, working a part time job etc. to make their allowances to spend on things.. Some of them spend the money toward drugs, alcohol, or save up and buy a car. You know how dangerous teenage drivers are and of course drugs are bad mkay.. Thus, it's only logical that we ban teenage labor and the practice of giving monetary allowance to teens. If you can't see the logic in that, then you're an ageist doodoo head.

[KisaiTenshi]

I can't believe people still cry on the forums about run-selling.

People who sell runs help less than spectacular players get clears. They take their time to drag someone through content. Why should they do it for free? Not how it works in the real world, why should it work that way here?

Er no. Greedy players are taking advantage of a loop-hole in the ToS whereby it's not illegal to sell carries through content using in-game resources... I've done something like this in other games, but it was because nobody could be bothered to keep the low-level gear and physical character hair/eye colors required to get through that one storyline set of fetch quests. I've never sold "carries" through combat, because that's just outright not fun for me, and isn't fun for them. Honestly, I have a hard time believing anyone legitimately earned more than 2 million gil without knowingly interacting with bought gil. Nobody is asking for then to do it for free, or out of the goodness of their heart *cue Disney music*

It's about the ramifications of who and where this gil is coming from. Nobody can earn these absurd "clear" prices, which means that they either bought the gil from RMT or the sellers selling their gil to RMT.

You're missing the point entirely. It's not an argument against run-selling it's about the consequences of it..

Some teenagers do chores like mowing the lawn, shoveling snow, working a part time job etc. to make their allowances to spend on things.. Some of them spend the money toward drugs, alcohol, or save up and buy a car. You know how dangerous teenage drivers are and of course drugs are bad mkay.. Thus, it's only logical that we ban teenage labor and the practice of giving monetary allowance to teens. If you can't see the logic in that, then you're an ageist doodoo head.

Child/Teen labor is a scam. Donchaknow that parents only have kids so they can use them as slaves? It's no wonder the kids on the Anonymous Troll forums think their life is so hard. The best thing teens can do is move out of their home and learn that the real world treats them exactly the same way they treat it. Grocery stores and Retail may suck, but teens would quickly learn that being an entitled asshat means not having that job very long.

Unlike some video game where you can buy your way through content and claim you finished it. It's not in SE's best interests to allow people to "carry" other players through content, because that exhausts the content quickly, and then you get ridiculous time-sink stuff like the relic weapon quests RNGesus fail to take up the slack.

[tocsin]

snip.

Not sure if troll post or not...

Honestly, if you aren't earning more than 2 million gil in this game, with even a single craft at 50, you aren't cut out for the gil side of endgame. Gil grows on trees in this game, and 2 mil for a carry really isn't that unreasonable, especially for something that cannot be cleared through normal means. Hell, you can earn 400k per week, without even touching the market board. source: http://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/commen...een_gil_guide/

also, if it isn't a troll post, try queuing the Disney music to one of the "saw" franchise movies. it works rather well.
tl'dr: my heart is black and dead. either pay with gil, pay with items, or go away.

Kinda sad you are blocking someone else from getting a house there.

one is a house for my FC as a whole, and the other one is for me personally. both are furnished, and I use them both regularly.

[KisaiTenshi]

Not sure if troll post or not...

Someone is not going to spend their 250K/wk allowance of daily content on a Coil clear because that would take them a bit over two months on that content alone. You know, provided they don't need to repair their gear or something

Anyway. What the RMT's are doing are selling Materia, because I keep seeing the same high level crafter and his 7 BLM/WHM bots in the same place every day.

[GenJoe]

Honestly, I have a hard time believing anyone legitimately earned more than 2 million gil without knowingly interacting with bought gil. . . Nobody can earn these absurd "clear" prices, which means that they either bought the gil from RMT or the sellers selling their gil to RMT.

wait what?? I'm lost.. Are you saying that anybody with over 2 million gil must've had something to do with RMT in order to get that much gil? Just to get to where you are in game, I'm sure you've gone through at least that much gil.. Maybe you didn't save them up, but it's passed through your hands..

It's like the average person in US will earn a salary of over a million dollars in life time earnings, but very few ever see that much money at once. That doesn't mean that millionaires don't exist among us, there are some insanely rich folks in real life as well as in Eorzea.. legitimately (legality wise, let's not get into the ethics of lawyers, doctors, etc..)

Someone is not going to spend their 250K/wk allowance of daily content on a Coil clear because that would take them a bit over two months on that content alone. You know, provided they don't need to repair their gear or something

250k/week is very little in-game currency.. 4 star crafters can earn 300k-1m just by crafting 1 piece of 4 star gear and that only takes like 2 minutes and the cost of Bouillabaisse.. Selling the said item is a different story, and I don't wanna go into the whole market board profitability discussion, but let's just say, if you have the will to make gil, it's easy to make it. I just bought 250k worth of razor clams earlier today by somebody who was fishing to get his achievements.. that was 170 of them, I'm no fisher, but I think that can be done in under 3 hours or so..

[tocsin]

Let me pose a similar question to everyone here.

I sometimes will have large spiritbonding sessions, where I will get a group of like 6 or 7 people together, pay each of them 500k and give them all the gear, and have them stand in range while wearing 5 subsequent 11 piece sets of i45 crafter gear, while I kill mobs in urths gift for 3 hours, and then I get all their materia. I usually do 100k per set, or 500k per run, invest 2.4 mil in materials (assuming 68k per set in mats), and 3.5 mil in pay, for 385 pieces of t3 and t4 materia, which on the marketboard is worth about 10-12 mil for a 3 hour work time.

Is this ethical?

(edit: no, this isn't just this simple, there are a lot more mechanics to it. I simplified a little to prove the point. )

[GenJoe]

That would depend on how much you're selling the materia for on the MB.. because if you price them too high, you're gonna force people to use RMT to get the gil to buy your materia

You need to also ensure that none of the RMT gil buyers buy your product so make sure that you interview your potential customers before they buy your wares

[Ashkendor]

It's about the ramifications of who and where this gil is coming from. Nobody can earn these absurd "clear" prices, which means that they either bought the gil from RMT or the sellers selling their gil to RMT.

I have close to 90 million gil and two houses to my name (a medium for my FC and a small for me), so that automatically means that I participate in RMT? How about no. In fact, I probably detest RMT even more than the average player. It destroys the economy, which has always been a fun part of any game for me. I don't have the kind of real life cash that would allow me to have that much money, not to mention SE's staff would have to be asleep at the wheel to not have tracked down a huge amount of gil like that by now. I don't believe in having a bot program play the game for me. I'd much rather play it myself. I actually don't participate in selling runs regularly. I've done a few here and there, but it's very spotty at best; usually I end up helping friends or friends of friends clear for free.

It's quite easy to earn massive amounts of gil in this game if you learn what to do and dedicate enough time to it. I try to keep a full 4 retainers worth of items on the market at all times. Even if I'm busy, I try to keep them at least half full. I keep it diverse, selling everything from food to base mats like ingots to stuff I grow in my garden. I spiritbond while doing most things in game; anything from farming to grinding out base mats to making relics sees me rolling around in level 39, 49, or 70 accessories. Most people that complain about not being able to earn gil either don't have the know-how, the time, or the drive to do so. It's just like anything else in the game - it takes skill and it takes work.