Why I have no interest in Coils more specifically, T9.

[Zohar_Lahar]

For one, WoD came out AFTER T9 did, WoD came out after T13 did. So that complaint isnt really valid. Also, you originally had to have a premade party to even enter coil, as you do with the current raid. They weren't even IN DF to begin with.

But they are on Duty Finder now, just like World of Darkness and Keeper of the Lake. So why shouldn't we expect the difficulty to remain consistent with other content on Duty Finder? Do you see the word (Hardcore) next to the area names in the opening cinematic for Coil Turns? The text in-game makes no effort to distinguish the mechanical difficulty between "Crystal Tower" raid or "Binding Coil" raids.

The fact toxic elitists like to treat those who haven't cleared T5/T9 with contempt or condescendingly claim Coil is "easy" only makes this much worse.

[gamesmart]

But they are on Duty Finder now, just like World of Darkness and Keeper of the Lake. So why shouldn't we expect the difficulty to remain consistent with other content on Duty Finder? Do you see the word (Hardcore) next to the area names in the opening cinematic for Coil Turns? The text in-game makes no effort to distinguish the mechanical difficulty between "Crystal Tower" raid or "Binding Coil" raids.

Why SHOULD we expect the difficulty to be in line with stuff DESIGNED to be easier than it just because it's accessible from the same spot? The text makes no effort to distinguish the difficulty because it doesn't need to. The first set of turns is easy enough, but raises enough warning flags to tell people to stay away from them if they don't want to dive head-first into raiding. Besides, there's always other, you know, people to talk to about it.

[hallena]

But they are on Duty Finder now, just like World of Darkness and Keeper of the Lake. So why shouldn't we expect the difficulty to remain consistent with other content on Duty Finder? Do you see the word (Hardcore) next to the area names in the opening cinematic for Coil Turns? The text in-game makes no effort to distinguish the mechanical difficulty between "Crystal Tower" raid or "Binding Coil" raids.

The fact toxic elitists like to treat those who haven't cleared T5/T9 with contempt or condescendingly claim Coil is "easy" only makes this much worse.

You know something is wrong with both the community and the duty finder when people assume if its on the DF it should be easy and free loot.
As for "Toxic elitist" in this game, some elitist are mostly mean because they are sick of bad players trying to get the only 4 hard boss in the game nerfed because literally the rest of the game is not enough for you.
Believe it or not, but not everyone is part of the facebook generation. There are still humans out there who enjoy overcoming challenges instead of waiting to be spoonfed.

[Zohar_Lahar]

You know something is wrong with both the community and the duty finder when people assume if its on the DF it should be easy and free loot.
As for "Toxic elitist" in this game, some elitist are mostly mean because they are sick of bad players trying to get the only 4 hard boss in the game nerfed because literally the rest of the game is not enough for you.

That's how they set up the game. Everything besides Coil is very casual and welcoming. How can you condemn us for expecting the game to be consistent? Thank you at least for demonstrating how Coil is creating a toxic atmosphere in this game.

[hallena]

That's how they set up the game. Everything besides Coil is very casual and welcoming.

And you're right. So stay away from coil if you can't handle it and stop trying to get it nerfed

So, let me get this straight, you are stating that there are players who are jerks to others in-game because they are upset that some random person on the Internet went to SE's forum and asked for something to be made easier?

Really?

I mean, really?

Holy crap, talk about a razor thin justification for poor behavior.

Nobody would be upset if SE didn't listen to people crying. Numerous things has been nerfed because "it's too hard ;_;"

[Wournsfeik_Untawhasyn]

That's how they set up the game. Everything besides Coil is very casual and welcoming. How can you condemn us for expecting the game to be consistent?

Because it was only added to the DF after you had to go to the location with 7 other people and manually enter it. It's known by the community to be the hardest current content. To not know that it is would require you to throw up serious blinders. It's kind of like asking how you're supposed to know that Dynamis in FFXI was serious Alliance Tier content. If you knew what Dynamis was, you were going to figure it out in short order. The same is true for the Binding Coil, nothing stops you from trying, but you'll learn in a hurry.

And if rude awakenings aren't your thing, I'm sorry. But sometimes that sort of thing happens, you either walk away or accept that a challenge has been put in your lap and soldier on.

[Kosmos992k]

That's how they set up the game. Everything besides Coil is very casual and welcoming. How can you condemn us for expecting the game to be consistent? Thank you at least for demonstrating how Coil is creating a toxic atmosphere in this game.

Before I begin, please understand I am not criticizing the players in static teams, I am critical of the entire lockout/loot system and overly tuned content that requires a static team to clear and repeat - not the players.

Static groups were identified in August 2013 by several posters on this forum as toxic to the community because they do several things;

1) segregate the community into haves & have not - (I have a static/I have not got a static)
2) segregate the community into raider/casual, because only those in statics could have a serious chance of clearing even titan HM - back in the day - and *only* players in a static could hope to clear BCOB at all.
3) players were disenfranchised by the strict lockouts and rules that prevent any flexibility in coil static membership

Over time with the EX primals which also required a static to clear for the first 3-6 months (or longer) of their life, SCOB and FCOB which require not only clearing T5, but also having a static, the separation between raiding community and everyone else has grown. Coil gear drops have consistently been the best in slot and highest ilvl in the game further emphasizing the difference between haves and have nots.

The requirement for static teams comes not only from the lockouts on the content, but also the difficulty and razor balance of the content to where a single mistake by anyone causes a wipe. This emphasizes the team dancing (some call it team jump rope) element where the team has to know the exact timing of the encounter and phases and where they should go and when, and execute the dance to perfection or face a wipe. Building that kind of rapport with the team and learning the dance requires a static team who are focused on their static team and it's progress.

Naturally, such teams are not that willing to break up to help others when they finally get the content cleared and 'on farm'. The horrible drop rate and lockouts further reinforce the segregation because even though a team has cleared something, they need to re-run it many times over several weeks/months to ensure that all team members get the drop that they deserve as their reward for helping each other.

That overly tuned content that requires static teams is a problem. It makes this type of content extremely toxic to any players outside a static since a single mistake by anyone causes wipes, and ultimately, static teams are intolerant of players who are slower to get content than others, and gradually the statics become even more insular, despite the fact that most of the content is in DF now, the potential for wipes does tend to keep people in their statics instead of banging their heads off the wall of accidental wipes.

So, fast forward to now. We have a vocal raiding community who believes that coil is easy and anyone can do it, and we have an army of players still gated on T5, never mind the rest of it. There is a huge yawning chasm between these two communities of players, in short the community is split. Unfortunately the haves have a pretty poor view of the have nots, and the have nots have noticed this.

Personally, I hope that the 3.0 expansion addresses some of these issues. having a normal mode version of the raid content - without the gear drops - would go a long way to fixing things, and that is something that has been confirmed in 3.0.

[Kosmos992k]

As for "Toxic elitist" in this game, some elitist are mostly mean because they are sick of bad players trying to get the only 4 hard boss in the game nerfed because literally the rest of the game is not enough

So, let me get this straight, you are stating that there are players who are jerks to others in-game because they are upset that some random person on the Internet went to SE's forum and asked for something to be made easier?

Really?

I mean, really?

Holy crap, talk about a razor thin justification for poor behavior.

[ziddyt]

So, let me get this straight, you are stating that there are players who are jerks to others in-game because they are upset that some random person on the Internet went to SE's forum and asked for something to be made easier?

Really?

I mean, really?

Holy crap, talk about a razor thin justification for poor behavior.

Just like your razor thin justification of kicking fc members for selling runs because it "promotes rmt?"

[Kosmos992k]

Just like your razor thin justification of kicking fc members for selling runs because it "promotes rmt?"

Since you know nothing about the reasons for the decisions made beyond what I posted about run selling in another topic, I would advise you to leave it alone. I would also suggest that bringing that topic up here is intentionally inflammatory and attempting to incite an argument.


...and that's all you're getting from me on that.


...popcorn sales decline.