Yoshi P, is this what you wanted? (Terra Branford Blues)

[Welsper59]

Don't confound what I'm saying with what you think I'm saying to inflate your opinion. What you asked specifically was...



To which I answered, yes. I absolutely believe that players would enjoy the grind more if it was something quantifiable that you could plan on instead of a RNG based grind that could take you weeks or months to complete when another player could complete them in hours solely because the system is wholly uneven and unfair. Light grinding, books, and even novus materia melding were entirely quantifiable and were better than just the pure RNG in my opinion. It's not a defendable system unless you're one of the lucky ones that got the good rolls on the RNG. Even if you're a player that's been in the MMO world for the 20-ish years they've been out you shouldn't defend the pure RNG solely because "that's how it's been." There are middle grounds between the two, but none of them exist in the game right now and that's the problem.



I know there are players on my server that re-upped their account solely for Gold Saucer. Triple Triad and chocobo racing was a huge draw to a lot of players.

As I stated in that reply, you're referring to something being easier by comparison to the other methods already required to do it. The format itself is no more enjoyable with mindless quantifiable content than it is with RNG. Both ways involve you redoing stuff (as is MMORPG expectations), both ways involve you enduring repetition (tome capping/farming, weekly CT/Coil, etc; stuff that is boring but we're used to). Why is that difficult to see? I even provided examples of this lol. My question centered around a sole concept as being an enjoyable process, again, something that I provided examples for and that, I'd think, you'd also agree isn't exactly "enjoyable". Enjoying the process is irrelevant to enjoying the reward. I'm not saying that it needs to ALWAYS exist, but that it serves a purpose, even if just temporary. And that's where feedback comes in. RNG separates people for a specific reason, but that's also why they lighten up on it over time (usually). Again, I'm not arguing that it needs to always be there, just that it has a purpose.

Also, just because a player does something for whatever reason, doesn't mean that it's the intent behind its creation. I could log on solely to just run around without gear, kill mobs without gear, etc. Was that literally intended by the devs for me to do? I would think not lol. I can if I want to though. A player, such as myself, may be playing specifically for one thing... but it doesn't mean that the reason they made it was to keep me here and ONLY here. The Gold Saucer is simply more content for players, as a whole, to take part in. Mind you, as I was implying in that post you quoted, the Gold Saucer was NOT intended to keep you away from the rest of the game. We, as players, don't have to follow that intent, so if we want to make it the reason we sub... so be it... doesn't mean that's what the devs literally intend for me to do though.

There's absolutely nothing generic about it. I've definitively told you: Farming for the Moggle Mog XII card is not fun. I haven't started on it yet, but I can imagine that farming for the Terra Branford card is equally not fun. It's the laziest and most sadistic method of introducing new content by forcing you to run content, some of which is over one year old and has long since lost its appeal, numerous times to try and get around an obscene drop rate. It's maintaining player activity in the worst way possible. I would absolutely be having more fun if I were playing Triple Triad with people or even NPCs. Triple Triad is meaningful content to me. Grinding instances, however, is not, and yet to fully enjoy the former, I'm stuck doing the latter.

And you absolutely can compare the two genres. They might play differently, but one will definitely steal my business away from the other based on how much more enjoyment I'm having with it compared to the other. For someone who keeps espousing about maintaining subscriptions and player activity, I shouldn't have to point that out. I can reference -any- genre, and so long as it is more fun and more enjoyable than FFXIV to the point of me ceasing to play FFXIV, then FFXIV is the loser in that scenario, no matter the genre. If I find something that is more fun and entertaining than taking another masochistic day (for what will now be the ninth day) of farming Moggle Mog XII (with probably the same results as the first eight), you can bet I will drop XIV for it, and that's a problem for XIV if other players feel the same way as me.

And, judging by a few responses in this thread, some other players do.

You're still not understanding what that reply was stating. You're arguing a topic that had nothing to do with that (of which if we were talking about that, I could agree with on some parts). My original question (which was aimed at someone else talking about F2P games) dealt with the aftermath (where you bought everything you wanted) and your earlier reply about "fun" suggested you were onboard with that derailed topic. Then you spout stuff about how you acquire this gear... you acquire the gear by paying for it in that argument. Don't jump in on an argument/debate without knowing what it's about.

And no, you can't compare genres on expectations of fun. I take that back, you could... but it'd be completely irrelevant. For example, I could say I really enjoy visual novels and hate the fact I'm playing a game that makes me have to actually control a character, since I'd rather read about the battles, so they need to change the way the game is, otherwise...

you can bet I will drop XIV for it

The reason you can only credibly compare games within a single genre is because of reasons like that. You have to compare what is possible within the limitations of the genre, otherwise, you'd be changing it. You can certainly compare certain aspects of it, but it's extremely limited. For example, you can compare limited resources in a Survival Horror game to something related to limited resources in another genre. That isn't necessarily comparing genres though, since it's not limited to one genre, so much as it is comparing secondary design ideas. Universal ideas that any genre may or may not have (like voiced characters). You can SUGGEST content that makes a different genre what it is, such as scares that a horror game would have, but you can't COMPARE the two.