Housing market value & insane prices?

[Aeyis]

You see? That's the problem. There's some stupid mentality where people decided housing was a luxury when it really shouldn't be. That was NOT the point of housing, and the amount of features being added to housing in the first place is proof enough.

(That said, it might be true about PERSONAL housing. But that's something I was against, and wish they hadn't implemented. It completely killed the Free Company housing market.)

I'm sorry if you misunderstood, but yes I was referring to personal housing. Personal housing is nothing more then a luxury really.
Yes, it could be made available to everyone nearly right away; and at only a small cost at gil (if any at all).
But that would also no doubt decrease the amount of things we can change/do with the house.

You mention features tho. What feature of housing is not a luxury? I've yet to use any housing only feature. (altho my FC does have a house)

Hale Storm's dedication in not in question. If you knew her like we do, you would think twice before saying things like that.

For the record, dedication isn't measured in how much gil you can stash in X amount of time. It's not because someone is a long-time player that this player's guaranteed to be rich. Not everyone spends their entire time obsessing over getting rich. There are plenty of players who aggressively obsess over making the most possible Gil, but don't actually enjoy the game more than they would any other MMORPG. Dedication is taking part in the community, providing building blocks for a better tomorrow with positive ideas and engagement. In that sense, Hale's more dedicated to Final Fantasy XIV than you or I, without a doubt.

She has a rare talent of spreading liveliness and originality in her wake. We value her opinions, as they are overflowing with the most sincere desire to see this game flourish and improve.

I can only measure a persons dedication based on what they themselves write. You say a lot about the OP, but you seemed to have missunderstand that the ''dedication'' that was referred to was dedication towards getting a house, not towards anything else.


I have almost 15m gil right now, after having played for only 2 months from 0-50. (I did not keep anything from 1.0)
Why, because I care about gil? No. Because I thought to myself: ''I really want to get a house, so I will use any gil I get that I dont need for my normal expenses to save up so that in a few months I can buy that house''
^Regardless of the time taken in doing this (it could take a player 6 months, maybe even a year); simply having that goal is the kind of dedication I was referring to.

Anyone that really would a house would do no less, I think.



But I digress. Your reply to this topic is a tad bit late. Namely, after the server prices were posted which does effect things quite a bit.

So... game should not be fun, is that what you're trying to say?

I'm sorry, but did you even read what I replied that to? OP seemed to have misread what I posted; thinking I posted the exact opposite of what I did.

Dedication? really? Do you even understand the meaning of it?
FYI, I know some expert crafter who makes great deal of gil, only to burn them so fast for overmelding stuff just to make it more beneficial for advance content he/she's doing. That's dedication.

I'm been doing both that and saving up for a house. At the same time. Both from scratch. While I will not claim to have more dedication then the person you are referring to, I would certain claim to know something about the meaning of dedication.

Having house plots available after patch went live, only to have it being cleared out so fast for ppl who has crazy fast connection, that's not dedication. Also, not all ppl have the luxury of having a really... really fast internet connection, so fast that when the patch live, you can just go so fast to buy the plots which ran out very quickly in minutes.

A valid argument. However the OP was all about prices being to high, not there not being enough plots. Sorry if I misunderstood the thread title or the OP itself, but it clearly states that the thread is about prices being to high.

And please check the fact on the server before you blabbing your mouth. Masamune only has large housing left to purchase. Is it that worth to spend on personal housing? FC yes, personal? Really?

Depends, how much is large housing on your server? If you really want a house more then anything, personally I would say it was worth it. I believe someone in another thread mentioned trying to make a deal with someone to sell their (small or medium then) house. I'm not sure how doable that is tho, but it is a possiblity.
I'm aware that some people on larger population servers tend to consider theirs more important then others, but I will take that advice.

While I can't really disagree, I don't think luxury's the right word and certainly not a bad idea. Housing are in fact basic needs in real life besides food and clothes. Do you rather live under the bridge than trying to earn a shelter as your own? Just think that logically. You're trying to compare housing with having jewerly? Really?

ARR is not real life. You will not die or lose your inventory if you don't have a house to stay in. It provides nothing you need to actually play the game or do anything notable in it. That clearly makes it a luxury. Inside of a game like ARR housing is quite comparable to having jewelry (glamour). It would be different if lets say your retainers could only be accessed from inside of a house, or your mailbox etc.

[Inzoum]

I have almost 15m gil right now, after having played for only 2 months from 0-50. (I did not keep anything from 1.0)

Great, now try doing that on Masamune. Good luck. Godspeed, and let me know how it turns out. We'll talk about it then.

[Aeyis]

Great, now try doing that on Masamune. Good luck. Godspeed, and let me know how it turns out. We'll talk about it then.

Another response after the price inquiry of Masamune? Sure, I will try it. After you actually read posts.

[Inzoum]

Another response after the price inquiry of Masamune? Sure, I will try it. After you actually read posts.

I've been following this entire thread from the beginning, before you even stepped in to comment. I've read your posts as well as everyone else's in this thread. I don't believe the topic is closed because some prices on our server were listed, like you seem to think. I don't see why you should decide that everything's been said and done because someone posted a few materia prices. That "price inquiry" is far from exhaustive and doesn't fully illustrate the market's situation. It doesn't settle the debate at all and there's still plenty of things to say. If people still have things to add, I don't see why they shouldn't.

Think twice before you insinuate that people don't or can't read what others have posted.

Edit: I guess that means you can try making 15 million on Masamune now.

[Aeyis]

snip

That price inquiry definately does show the market situation. I believe I agreed with someone that said your economy is screwed over. That makes it pretty clear that its hard to obtain millions (at this point in time). The fact that you still respond as you do shows that either you really misunderstood a number of posts (if you like I can requote all of them) or just didnt read posts at all.
If as you say the market situation cant be judged based on those examples, that means your market situation is better then those examples portray.


It doesnt change the fact tho, that this thread should have been about Masamuns messed up economy, not housing prices.

Think twice before you insinuate that people don't or can't read what others have posted.

I responded to each section with quotes before already, do you really want me to be even more specific?

If people still have things to add, I don't see why they shouldn't.

I havent seen anyone add anything new to the discussion after those prices were mentioned. Naturally, they are more then welcome to. Perhaps you could ask even more of your friendlists if perhaps they too have something to contribute?

[Inzoum]

I havent seen anyone add anything new to the discussion after those prices were mentioned.

I'd say you're being awfully selective and dismissing a lot of arguments to better kill this thread.

Naturally, they are more then welcome to. Perhaps you could ask even more of your friendlists if perhaps they too have something to contribute?

And what exactly are you suggesting? How is this snarky remark relevant to the topic at hand? Please. Don't be that guy.

[Aeyis]

I'd say you're being awfully selective and dismissing a lot of arguments to better kill this thread.



And what exactly are you suggesting? How is this snarky remark relevant to the topic at hand? Please. Don't be that guy.

You say that, but I've posted a heck of a lot of times now when I saw my intention of words being misunderstood. Why havent you responded to any of those occasions? Really (wo)man, the ball is in your court, and has been for an entire damn page.

I'd say you're being awfully selective and dismissing a lot of arguments to better kill this thread.

For someone trying to kill a thread I'm sure typing a lot of words.

You are also welcome to give me a single argument I dismissed, or any arguments I missed due to being selective. The only arguments I've seen I argued against. I've not intentionally dismissed any, nor did I choose which to argue against.


Well nevermind that, I've already said what I wanted to say quite a few times now, it is up to you to read any of the numerous occassions or not. I do hope however that you have some appreciation for the Hour and a Half of my time that I gave you, which time aside also cost my beastman dailies..

Sometimes I just don't know why I bother to reply anymore..

[Inzoum]

That price inquiry definately does show the market situation. (...) If as you say the market situation cant be judged based on those examples, that means your market situation is better then those examples portray.

Or worse. And believe me, it actually is worse.

It doesnt change the fact tho, that this thread should have been about Masamuns messed up economy, not housing prices.

Depends, how much is large housing on your server? If you really want a house more then anything, personally I would say it was worth it.

That's the biggest problem. Economy health and housing prices both go together hand-in-hand, so it's really all entirely relevant. You're being very quick to dismiss a lot of arguments that are definitely related to the problem at hand. You may think I don't read very well, I think you don't reason very well.

While Masamune's economy is flat on the ground, and it's very difficult to make money off the market, the server housing prices are rated in the highest tier:
http://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...1e2bc04d014cbf

Prices have lowered since, but plot availability is depleted, apart from large plots which now range from 35,000,000 to 43,750,000

We have lowest revenues but we're forced to pay the highest price.

For the record, I have a small private house, which I bought MINUTES after the patch went up. I have spent insane amounts of time saving up for it, sacrificing progress on every other front (crafting/gathering gear, relic...), and it has left me ruined and unable to catch up on my crafting gear for several patches after. I've finally caught up, but now that I have, I've been unable to profit from anything anymore, with even HQ 4 start crafts yielding pocket change for profit, when it sells after sitting idle for 3 weeks in an undercut race.

[Aeyis]

Or worse. And believe me, it actually is worse.

I think you would do well not to underestimate others dedication towards working the market.
The items that were listed as example might be only few, but they are very good examples of items that sell well nearly everywhere.
Based on those prices the knowledgable people (that would be Gillionaire and MomomiMomi) accessed that your economy is very bad. I could only agree with them. If you notice my first post the first sentence actually has me asking what the prices are like on Masamune. In fact pretty much all posts from everyone on that page are related to that.

You have to realise, that while your advise not to talk about knowing the situation on another server is certainly sound advice; we did inquire.
And naturally if the prices tend to be extremely difference a mild disbelieve is not out of the question.
The same can be said with the responses from a larger population server when finding it strange that others find the prices for housing ''okay''
You too have to consider what the others perspective in this discussion might be.

That's the biggest problem. They both go together hand-in-hand, so it's really all entirely relevant. You're being very quick to dismiss a lot of arguments that are definitely related to the problem at hand.

The thing is: and I've said it several times now. The main problem is not the housing, it is your servers economy. I believe you might want to talk to people from Balmung, who would love to have any plot available regardless of price or housing; and they too are a high population server like yours. If your economy was not such a huge issue you might well not even have a problem with housing right now..

You may think I don't read very well, I think you don't reason very well.

You are entitled to think that. However, my assement of your reading ability is not a opinion so much as an observation. It's not that I disagree with what you reply, you see. It is just that it replies to something I did not actually say?
My reasoning tho, it could definately use improvement; but I do try.

While Masamune's economy is flat on the ground, and it's very difficult to make money off the market, the server housing prices are rated in the highest tier:
http://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...1e2bc04d014cbf

Housing prices are only related to size of population at the time they made those brackets. See my earlier suggestion about it. (the clarification of which is in the big post I edited on this page, in response to the OP)

Prices have lowered since, but plot availability is depleted, apart from large plots which now range from 35,000,000 to 43,750,000

We have lowest revenues but we're forced to pay the highest price.

Which again, is because your servers economy is at fault.



The point being. The big evil here is the economy on Masamune being extremely bad. All of points made in the OP about housing prices will pretty fall on deaf ears if you present them as suggestion, because many people on other large population servers (with no plots left) would glad pay 30-40m...if there were plots to be had.
The main issue that most have with housing these days, appear to be lack of available plots; rather then the prices themselves. (altho prices may be included if we asssume small plots)


The way I see it; if you want to suggested an improvement for your situation towards SE; you've 2 choices. Either focus on Masamunes economy being bad and it making it impossible to use features such as housing. (a very valid concern considering Masamunes economy)
Or, well that is it really; frankly. The OP has too many easily disputed arguments in it. When it could be a well writting post about Masamunes bad economy, and the effects it has on the housing market for that server.


Rather then trying to argue with me (and trying to refute that you arent reading posts clearly), should you not help the OP in putting forth a great suggestion?

[Inzoum]

I think you would do well not to underestimate others dedication towards working the market.

I don't have to, I'm among them. I'm at the top of both crafting and gathering chains. I have a private house (by that measure, I "won" that battle, but it took a heavy toll). It wouldn't be possible anymore after the way the economy tanked. I used to make money working the market, now I don't, and it's not because I'm not looking for ways.

However, my assement of your reading ability is not a opinion so much as an observation. It's not that I disagree with what you reply, you see. It is just that it replies to something I did not actually say?

I disagree that this can be qualified as an observation. There is no way you can know whether I have actually read these posts without peering over my shoulder as I do. By that measure, your remark clearly isn't directed at whether I have or haven't read these posts, but is rather directed at my reading ability. Your opinion (not observation) was that my comments were not appropriate with the topic at hand according to you and your vision of things, again something I disagree with.

I believe calling people out on their reading ability is foul and counter-productive. It is nothing more than a personal attack. It has no place here.

Rather then trying to argue with me (and trying to refute that you arent reading posts clearly), should you not help the OP in putting forth a great suggestion?

For one, I shouldn't even have to refute anything, because you should never have resorted to such low personal attacks. You did not see where I was going with my remark, so I explained, and I would still defend the validity of my comment regarding the problem at hand. Your insinuations were uncalled for and I do no take the insult lightly.

Speaking of insinuations, what was that about my friend list?


Second, Hale doesn't need my help putting forth great suggestions.

My posts were meant to argue about the situation of Masamune's economy, which you and I both agree is a key factor in people's inability to access housing. It's not the only one, but it takes a particular importance when put in comparison to the pricing brackets for housing on Masamune (highest tier of all servers), which is a very real issue. If you ask someone to climb a hill by crawling on his hands and knees, it's already difficult enough without turning that hill into a mountain.

Without your ill-intentioned dismissal, I would not have had to justify my post and this thread would still be on track. You are not the master of this thread, quit acting like you own the discussion.