playerbase down 25% in 4 months?

[Preypacer]

The functionality is pretty much the same, with added functions like window shopping and actual visualization of what you're buying on a character.

the time lost by moving into a ward and buying the item (which you already know is the cheapest) from an NPC (that you definitely don't need to "chase down" as it's clearly visible, marked, and rezzes before all the others (but yay for the use of hyperbolic terms to try and make things look worse), is negligible. So yeah, It's basically an AH, and it's laughable to see some screaming bloody murder about it because it's not called "Auction House".

"Yay for hyperbolic terms to try and make it look worse"? I was describing the steps required to purchase an item once you've located it.

Seriously... get off the defensive.

Not every response or disagreement with something you say is a personal attack. Not every description of something you personally are fine with is "hyperbole". In fact it's hyperbolic for you to characterize it as such.

FFS.

Whether it's "negligible" or not is completely subjective. The fact remains, it's extra steps required to do something that could otherwise be done with one or two simple menu clicks. Search Item > Select Item > Purchase Item.

Now go ahead and get all bent out of shape because I disagreed with you again.

[TonyMontana]

LOL, yeah, because having to actually go pick up an item at the market wards "turns off hordes of customers" right?

People with weak arguments need to make massive use of hyperbole to try and get a flawed point across. Must be some sort of natural law.



They're already implementing HQ search.

When? Its been 10.5 months since I started playing retail.

[Rinsui]

Pretty much that. At least for me, the time spent shoving my way through ever-spawning zombie retainers is not negligible.

And,

They're already implementing HQ search.

is not true either. The English post is just a poor translation of the Japanese original, which basically says that "server problems first have to be sorted out, but we know about the problem". I would be seriously astonished if we get a HQ search before October. And that's just a frickin' search functionality. Nothing more. So don't tell me that the wards are *almost* as good as a real Ah.

And yes, I think that not having a proper AH was the final nail in the coffin for many potential players. Hordes of, if you like. And a good number will not even have tried the game because "LOLZ it doesn't even have a AH", a point which is rightfully stressed in all the reviews I am aware of.

[minihalcyon]

The functionality is pretty much the same, with added functions like window shopping and actual visualization of what you're buying on a character.

the time lost by moving into a ward and buying the item (which you already know is the cheapest) from an NPC (that you definitely don't need to "chase down" as it's clearly visible, marked, and rezzes before all the others (but yay for the use of hyperbolic terms to try and make things look worse), is negligible. So yeah, It's basically an AH, and it's laughable to see some screaming bloody murder about it because it's not called "Auction House".

An auction house lets a player place bids on an item, not simply buy it. Also, auction houses typically aren't separated into dozens of rooms, filled with multiple people (retainers) through which you much search to find the items you've 'won'. There is something wrong with this in regards to flavor - it's a market ward, and not a functional auction house. If functionality was the same, so many people wouldn't be so quick to point out that they are, in fact, quite different.

Something feels off about it to a lot of players (as vocalized on the forums multiple times), so it's probably not yet correct to call it an AH. We'll know when this changes because, when it does, people will stop complaining that there is no AH, and instead start complaining about how much the AH sucks. ^^

[Abriael]

"Yay for hyperbolic terms to try and make it look worse"? I was describing the steps required to purchase an item once you've located it.

"chasing down" -> irrealistic hyperbole to make the process look more difficult than it is. You pop into the ward. The character is already there, clearly marked. It doesn't run away. There's no "chasing"

Whether it's "negligible" or not is completely subjective. The fact remains, it's extra steps required to do something that could otherwise be done with one or two simple menu clicks. Search Item > Select Item > Purchase Item.

You might have miscounted the clicks. With one or two clicks you don't even get to see the item list in all auction houses. Oh my god, there are "extra steps!"
It's negligible because it doesn't add a sizable amount of time to something that takes a minute (and on top of it gives additional functionality that an AH lacks). If a minute buying an item is such a big problem to you, so important that you think that a developer should waste development resources to completely scrap a system that most definitely works to implement a redundant one to save you a few clicks, sorry if i dare to laugh.

[Rinsui]

If a minute buying an item is such a big problem to you, so important that you think that a developer should waste development resources to completely scrap a system that most definitely works to implement a redundant one to save you a few clicks, sorry if i dare to laugh.

If a minute of turning a crank to start the engine of your car is such a hassle, then...
dang.

Btw: It doesn't matter what you believe or what the producers believe. People hate the wards. That's been proven by endless, countless numbers of polls, reviews, re-reviews and ragequits. We don't need to be convinced or proselytized. We are not small children, and neither you nor SE are our mommy. We don't like it, and we clearly stated why we don't. Whether you consider our arguments valid or not is completely unimportant. People simply leave.

And a hint for your life: sometimes when a girl tells you that she doesn't like you because you are fat, have greasy hair and smell of rotten cow dung, trying to convince her of your "natural charm" may be less effective than simply working out and taking a shower once in a while.

[Abriael]

An auction house lets a player place bids on an item, not simply buy it.

No, that's ONE kind of auction houses. There are tons of games that have auction houses that involve no bidding at all.
Mind you, it's funny that you bring this up, as actual action houses that involve bidding are actually SLOWER than the market wards, as they involve more work in price checking and bidding.

Also, auction houses typically aren't separated into dozens of rooms, filled with multiple people (retainers) through which you much search to find the items you've 'won'.

You search through them in exactly the same way you do in an auction house -> Functional auction house.

There is something wrong with this in regards to flavor - it's a market ward, and not a functional auction house. If functionality was the same, so many people wouldn't be so quick to point out that they are, in fact, quite different.

Something feels off about it to a lot of players (as vocalized on the forums multiple times), so it's probably not yet correct to call it an AH. We'll know when this changes because, when it does, people will stop complaining that there is no AH, and instead start complaining about how much the AH sucks. ^^

MMORPG players are notoriously set in their ways, so much that you could define them fossilized. This is a clear proof of that. No matter how the market wards will become, people will whine because they're not named "auction house", which would make them feel that they have "won" by pressuring SE in scrapping a system that works to implement a redundant one.
Juvenile to say the least, but that's some MMORPG gamers for you.

If a minute of turning a crank to start the engine of your car is such a hassle, then...
dang.

Apples to oranges. You aren't turning a crank (repeatitive, meaningless action), you're walking to a clearly market shopkeeper to buy an item.
By your logic, there should be no walking at all in the game.

Btw: It doesn't matter what you believe or what the producers believe. People hate the wards. That's been proven by endless, countless numbers of polls, reviews, re-reviews and ragequits. We don't need to be convinced or proselytized. We are not small children, and neither you nor SE are our mommy. We don't like it, and we clearly stated why we don't. Whether you consider our arguments valid or not is completely unimportant. People simply leave.

Translation of above: "I don't like the market wards (because they're not named Auction House, how dare they!), and since there are some people that post that they agree with me, I will assume everyone does. "

Sorry, but:
you =/= Everyone
you =/= People
you =/= The majority
you =/= HORDES of customers lol.

But since you're the one that posted the misrepresenting and misleading statistic that started this thread, I'm not surprised that your ideas of statistics are skewed.

Anyway, that misleading and meaningless statistic based on a false assumption has been debunked. There isn't much else to discuss to this thread. I'd advise considering the basic premises of a statistic next time you want to post one. Spreading misleading data isn't really the best idea.

I'll ignore the juvenile personal attack, just because it ain't worth my time.

[Magiksmurf]

This will only get worser i believe.. 1 of the reasons is the extreme Mp costs on Cure. People that solo the compplete time they are on are now forced to party. As you would need a mage to get cured.
I played lesser since the 1.18 as it just doesn't seem to be in any use to play solo anymore. And i just don't like to party up.
The way it is now with the Mp.. It kind of is boring as you have to attack weaker mobs.
Guess we all have to wait and see what happens with the next patches.
But completely giving up on FF.. never There is still hope.

Why are ppl playing MMO's if they want to solo all the time??? You know, MASSIVE MULTIPLAYER = lots of peeps to join with. Why don't you go play offline single player RPG's instead??

[Rinsui]

Apples to oranges. You aren't turning a crank (repeatitive, meaningless action), you're walking to a clearly market shopkeeper to buy an item.
By your logic, there should be no walking at all in the game.

Well, let's see.

1. Open search menu
2. Find your item.
3. Mark your item.
4. Confirm.
5. Close menu.
6. Choose appropriate ward.
-- Loading Screen --
8. Wait for the zombies to pop up.
9. Search for the right combination of name and red star.
10. Shove your way through the ever-spawning hordes of zombies.
11. Mark the respective retainer.
12. Confirm.
13. Scroll through its menu.
14. Confirm.
15. Select yes.
16. Confirm again.
17. Close the menu.
18. Head for one of the ends of the ward.
19. Shove your way through the ever-spawning horde of zombies.
20. Reach the end of the ward and wait for the menu to open.
21. Select leaving the wards.
-- Loading Screen --
22. Yay! I just bought a fearie apple!

(I'll skip steps 23-77, which deal with buying a stack of +3 twigs. No need to be mean.)

[minihalcyon]

No, that's ONE kind of auction houses. There are tons of games that have auction houses that involve no bidding at all.
Mind you, it's funny that you bring this up, as actual action houses that involve bidding are actually SLOWER than the market wards, as they involve more work in price checking and bidding.



You search through them in exactly the same way you do in an auction house -> Functional auction house.



MMORPG players are notoriously set in their ways, so much that you could define them fossilized. This is a clear proof of that. No matter how the market wards will become, people will whine because they're not named "auction house", which would make them feel that they have "won" by pressuring SE in scrapping a system that works to implement a redundant one.
Juvenile to say the least, but that's some MMORPG gamers for you.

Well, if no bidding is involved, the semantics are incorrect. Auction Houses without bidding are more correctly called 'stores' (or, in the market wards case, 'bazaars"), and people should be clear in asking for such when arguing for them. I agree that the process of bidding is a longer process than simply buying an item - it's just another option that has been used in RPGs in the past.

Reading between the lines of some of the posts here, I'm gathering that the real issues in regards to the market wards are as follows:

1. There are several menus to navigate through. Problems with the clunky UI make this process as painful as it is in any other part of the game. It's probably not the number of clicks, but the delay between each click. This is relived once you find the retainer you've marked, since you have to again work through somewhat clunky targeting and sidebar menus to browse the retainer's items, and then a clunky purchase interface. These are mostly issues with the UI, and not the MW. The "stay in one place to do all of your shopping" mindset does alleviate some of these issues, but the UI would still make the experience a bit annoying. I believe UI fixes have been investigated and implemented (albeit in small doses) with each patch, so it may just be a matter of time before the bigger issue is tackled.

2. Once a desired item is found in the item search counter, the player must enter a new area to purchase it. This involves an awkward loading time and a transition to the same room that composes each section of the ward. For the bit of travel necessary to fetch the item, and the loading time involved, there is very little flavor or reason for things as they are.

I would like to mention, however, that there still is the issue of the AH in games like WoW, in which purchased items are placed in a Mailbox, and must be retrieved from there. This adds some travel time in the same fashion (and if many items are purchased at once, many items must be retrieved from the mailbox). Again, I think the issue is the slowness of the menus, and the loading time required to render a new room when travelling between market ward locations. They're just small annoyances that add up when executed in succession.