The Hunt Public Shaming Needs to end

[Giantbane]

It's a concept defined by the majority of the hunt population, not its entirety therefore Argumentum Ad Populum.

But what is or isn't early is purely a matter of opinion, and thus opinion matters. On the other hand, "Vaccines are bad for you because a lot of people believe it" is very obviously Argumentum Ad Populum because opinion has no bearing on whether or not that's true.

People tend to be drawn to be overly emotional about this particular topic to say the least so lies, exaggerations, hyperbole and the likes are widespread therefore their impact should be minimize. There is a reason why nearly no MMO allows naming and shaming on their forums.

Oh, of course you can't do it on the forums. But the start of this thread was about the public shaming that happens in shouts after a hunt is killed. Now granted, people are usually way too belligerent and usually aren't very good about their facts when they start screaming in the shout channels, so those sorts of people are definitely in the wrong. It's not that they can't have a public discussion on their server about when is too early, what are the benefits of waiting, or what can be done about those who refuse to follow popular hunt etiquette, but they need to be much more tactful about it.

[Dwill]

Yes, but mobs *can* be killed by almost any number of people and everybody can still get full credit as long as they're mildly organized. SE has done nothing to change this, and in fact made it easier for more people to kill A & S ranks by increasing their HP. So if someone chooses to kill it before all/most active hunt participants have been given a reasonable amount of time to get there (give it a couple minutes, depending on how far it is away from the aetheryte) then they're just being selfish and/or an ass at that point.

People have been arguing since The Hunt has been introduced about what is early and what isn't, even though Square Enix have mentioned that mobs were intended to be killed by a fixed number of players, not a quarter of the server zerging a target and quite frankly, it's not even up for debate for me and I have no desire to continue on this topic further as in this would be an endless loop of arguments repeating themselves.

Oh, of course you can't do it on the forums. But the start of this thread was about the public shaming that happens in shouts after a hunt is killed. Now granted, people are usually way too belligerent and usually aren't very good about their facts when they start screaming in the shout channels, so those sorts of people are definitely in the wrong. It's not that they can't have a public discussion on their server about when is too early, what are the benefits of waiting, or what can be done about those who refuse to follow popular hunt etiquette, but they need to be much more tactful about it.

I still find the concept of people getting emotional about the Hunt overly childish but there isn't much to be done about people and chat channels in MMO.

But what is or isn't early is purely a matter of opinion, and thus opinion matters. On the other hand, "Vaccines are bad for you because a lot of people believe it" is very obviously Argumentum Ad Populum because opinion has no bearing on whether or not that's true.

Opinions matters, for both sides. Yet during whatever people consider early pulling, only the popular opinion seems to matter which goes back to my previous statement.

[PrimeEvilPanda]

People rushing to hunts because they have to get to the mark to get points because they need the items/gear/glamour now because SE likes to nerf gear every other cycle to where it loses its value. #logic

[Zohar_Lahar]

It's more SE's fault than anything. They chose to put highly popular items only on the hunts, causing the participants to greatly exceed the practical capacity limit of Elite Marks.

Popular it may be, the developers have made it clear they only want the carbonstuff to be obtained in restricted amounts. So with that in mind, what makes the players feel they are entitled to have Carbontwine right now rather than patiently wait their turn?

[Giantbane]

I still find the concept of people getting emotional about the Hunt overly childish but there isn't much to be done about people and chat channels in MMO.

Yea, people get way too worked up. If they want to pursue this, most people really need to chill out and have a more rational discussion about it.

Opinions matters, for both sides. Yet during whatever people consider early pulling, only the popular opinion seems to matter which goes back to my previous statement.

It's really a matter of etiquette. I think etiquette is sort of defined by popular opinion. Most of the bickering on the forums/in game is in an effort to sway that opinion. (and/or plead with SE to avoid this entirely by having alternatives to hunts or allowing hunts to scale to the participants better).

[IndigoHawk]

Yawn. What needs to stop is people pulling early. It's not an opinion that it's early when someone pulls in less than a minute after the hunt has been spotted.

It would be like if someone asked me where my finger starts from my hand. I can point to my hand and point to my finger, but if I had to clearly define the boundaries down to the cell, that would be pretty difficult.

Even if I can't identify exactly how many seconds need to pass for an early pull, I can tell if the hunt was pulled early, just like any other reasonable person.

Claiming that everything is relative and an opinion is pretending the problem is too difficult to understand. If I pull before people have a reasonable chance to get a notification, load to the zone, and then arrive, group, and attack to get full credit, then it's too early.

[Giantbane]

Popular it may be, the developers have made it clear they only want the carbonstuff to be obtained in restricted amounts. So with that in mind, what makes the players feel they are entitled to have Carbontwine right now rather than patiently wait their turn?

If they really wanted it in restricted amounts there are better ways of restricting it than relying upon their players to be dbags towards one another.

[Abriael]

Every time i see someone get public shamed by someone on my service for an "early Pull" they it ticks me off.

A.) there were about 40+ People at the spot waiting for the hunt
B.) its the SAME person doing the shaming and it has not nor will it change since hunts first started
C.) I'll call you out every time on shout for bring a prick.

It literally serves no purpose as it will not lead to anything as only a fraction of the service does hunts anyway.

The early pulling needs to end. If someone doesn't want to be publicly shamed, all he has to do is to be a decent human being and wait.

Early pullers fully deserve the public shaming.

[Zedd702]

The early pulling needs to end. If someone doesn't want to be publicly shamed, all he has to do is to be a decent human being and wait.

Early pullers fully deserve the public shaming.

Thing is... Is that it's really hard to "define" early pulling.

On one hand you have many players camping out at the hunt, patiently waiting for others they hear on /shout are coming. After about 4+ minutes of patiently waiting, you get late comers that either just got wind of the hunt, because they just logged in, came back from making dat sammich among other things... And on another hand you those that pull as soon as they arrive with their hunt group...

As I suggested earlier in another thread. If there was a lockout circle around the hunt (for 2-4 minutes tops) the moment it was discovered, which would immediately display a message to ALL players on the map (color based on Rank). This would solve the rants of early pulling. The message that would display in the zone would allow players enough time to notify their FC/LS/etc of the hunt AND get to the location.

If you cannot get there in 2-4 minutes, that's your own fault... and see you next hunt.

[Anneliese]

Did I seriously just read about early pullers being compared to ISIS?