The Hunt Public Shaming Needs to end

[DoctorPepper]

If you're going to use forum behavior as a measurement for what's allowed in the game, then a simple "Will Smith pulled the mob" shout will never get anyone banned ever.

I think if somebody is harassing another player they should get a couple warnings and then be banned for harassment. Considering that the forum bans are for name shaming associated with in game screenshots one could make a general assumption that name shaming is harassment and should be treated as such. I'm not saying ban everybody who shouts a name but at least give them a warning and enforce it based on in game harassment policies.

Also, your example is not what most people consider name shaming. Name shaming, as several people have mentioned in this thread, is when people attempt to damage that persons in game experience or reputation by trying to get other people to blist them or by bullying them publicly with rude and/or vulgar language.

[Lucke]

Even something as simple as "Xxx pulled!" could lead to harassment. "Lucke Arrayo pulled!" and "Lucke Arrayo pulled! Blacklist him! He sucks!" will both lead to getting blacklisted and getting hateful tells. The way this community is, both of those will set people off in the same way. It shouldn't matter who pulled. Either start fighting the mob, or don't.

[Thayos]

Name shaming, as several people have mentioned in this thread, is when people attempt to damage that persons in game experience or reputation by trying to get other people to blist them or by bullying them publicly with rude and/or vulgar language.

Totally agree there's no need for the vulgar language or bullying. Yeah, blatant face-pull trolling annoys me, but it's just a game... and it's not like the handful of people who face-troll do this 24/7.

[Giantbane]

Even something as simple as "Xxx pulled!" could lead to harassment. "Lucke Arrayo pulled!" and "Lucke Arrayo pulled! Blacklist him! He sucks!" will both lead to getting blacklisted and getting hateful tells. The way this community is, both of those will set people off in the same way. It shouldn't matter who pulled. Either start fighting the mob, or don't.

If you say "Xxx pulled", you're just stating what he did. If you say "If you're in a party, FC, LS with Xxx, please ask him to wait for others because there's no benefit to pulling instantly" or something to that effect, I don't see how that's harassment at all. I'd be surprised if you got disciplined for that sort of thing.

If someone else takes that information and then shouts or sends nasty tells about that person's mom, family or otherwise then THAT second person is harassing them. But it's that second person who is doing the harassment that deserves punishment, not the first.

And if some other random player sees that "Xxx pulled" 3-4 times and decides to blacklist that player/kick him out of a hunt LS or his hunting party, I don't see why there's any problem with that. There's nothing in the ToS that says you have to group with or talk to selfish players.


Of course, what constitutes an early pull is up for debate. If you've waited a few minutes, called out a time to attack and went when you said you would, nobody should consider that an early pull.

[Sapphic]

And this is what early pullers are doing "Disruptive behavior that negatively affects the experience of others."

What if your LS decides that needs to wait 5 minutes, and another LS decides 4 minutes is enough? What about those who come 6 minutes after its called and start shouting abuse, saying "early puller *insert random mispelt expletives here*"? What about when half the server turns up and "Disrupts" those on PS3s that cannot then even see the mob? Should you Blist and cal out those who came after too? As they disrupting some players experience.

Also, due to comparing a non-issue to a real life serious issue, consider yourself reported

Not to mention your previous posts are prmoting going against the EULA by harrasing and disrupting others gameplay due to a made up ideal of "early puller". Whereas in fact, if the mob dies, it wasn't early. If there arent enough to kill and they die, then you can consider it early.

Also, as has happened, auto run, look away for 2 mins, and run straight into a hunt mob. Players go all smack happy instead of letting the person go splat or auto run there merry way till it resets. Are you going to harrass, name and shame the one on auto run or the ones who went all red line and attacked? First was an unintential accident, the follow up zerg is fully intentional.

Let's not forget, you accuse someone else of acting like a GM when all they did was quote a GMs reply when this issue was brought up before whilst demanding others should follow your rules otherwise they face harrasment from you and others you tell to do so. So it is you who should relaise you are just a player with no rights to set any form of rules to anyone outside of any LS, party or FC that players join and agree to said rules.

[MirielleLavandre]

Geez - this thread is still going. Personally, I don't think there is any such thing as an early pull unless people can do the legendary FFXI 'pull before the NM even shows up on NA players screens', in which case that may be a tad 'early' to we NA folk... But seriously, killing an S mark with 70+ other = boring and snooze-fest. Taking my own party of 8 and trying to beat it = challenge and fun. I don't know about others, but one of those two seems a bit more what the word 'hunt' implies, and is more exciting, as well!

What I think would be great...for Hunts only, have a claim system like the old FFXI (I know this isn't FFXI so no need to tell me). Those who find a hunt, as soon as they engage, it is claimed by that team and they either beat it, or die and others can try. It is nice to be all sharing and such with letting others get loot/xp/quest rewards for everything else... why not have just a little bit of competition in the game...?

[NyarukoW]

What if .....What about .. What about ... all nonsense hypotheticals...

It is not that complicated when you see the corpse of the early puller on the ground. The identify will be clear to everyone at the hunt.

Also, as has happened, auto run, look away for 2 mins, and run straight into a hunt mob. Players go all smack happy instead of letting the person go splat or auto run there merry way till it resets. Are you going to harrass, name and shame the one on auto run or the ones who went all red line and attacked?

More nonsense hypotheticals. Accidents happen. And beside if folks in the LS are properly disciplined and know to hold until pull time, and accidental pull by something will be automatically reset anyways no one needs to panic, and no name calling or harassment will ever follow. It is the repeat offender that deliberately trolls and disrupts the play of everyone else that will get blacklisted.

Not to mention your previous posts are prmoting going against the EULA by harrasing and disrupting others gameplay ...

Blacklisting trouble makers, be it spammers, gil sellers, or early pullers is certainly not against the EULA. As collective we have the right blacklist those who are harassing the vast majority of players. Identifying them and blacklisting them is not against anything the EULA. None the verbal harassment needs to happen, just simply identify and blacklist.

...The problem is you think players are states. ...
Players are GUESTS. Guests have no authority to make rules in someone else's home.

Players are not states, and I've never said that. The thing is neither is the legal system or the U.S. government top down one-way as you tried to present, nor is the relationship between SE and the playerbase.

And we are not guests and for player that live the game probably would claim this is there home not to mention the houses they have in game. SE does have police powers and is final arbiter but they will adjust rules depending on feedback, just like they instituted the withdrawal penalty, or adjust content difficulty. And even if we are guest, guests do get to make rules, the host should actually try to accomodate the guest as much as possible. You go to a restaurant and you provide the the rule that you are allergic to shellfish related stuff, they will do their best not serve you stuff that sends you the hospital, nor would your friends hosting a dinner party. And people that don't agree to saying grace before dinner don't have to either. Rules are arbitrary unless they are grounded in being solutions to practical matters, and properly negotiated between competing interests.

[Nestama]

Alternatively, SE should just turn Hunts into Treasure Hunt type mobs. You accept quest from the Hunting Scholar, you form a party with people who also have the quest, go to the designated spot, pop mob, beat it, get seals.. wait another 4 or something hours for the quest to become active again. For S ranks, though, the party leaders will need to form an alliance, accept the quest, do the required actions to pop their mob (spawns in random location marked on your map, so that two S rank mobs don't appear in the same spot in case another alliance is doing the quest. Required actions will be less restrictive than the current spawning mechanics) and then fight. The S rank quest will become available after 32 or something hours.

So it's the claim system similar to FFXI, but with 99% of the drama gone AND still open world.

[Delorean]

so ignore them and move on?

[Cadmar]

What I think would be great...for Hunts only, have a claim system like the old FFXI (I know this isn't FFXI so no need to tell me). Those who find a hunt, as soon as they engage, it is claimed by that team and they either beat it, or die and others can try. It is nice to be all sharing and such with letting others get loot/xp/quest rewards for everything else... why not have just a little bit of competition in the game...?

I can't agree with this enough and I'm glad someone finally said it. This notion that everyone deserves something... I just don't get it.