The Hunt Public Shaming Needs to end

[Kosmos992k]

...But the other players in response have every right to blacklist and protect their link shells from trouble makers like you.

Calling me a trouble maker, when you know nothing about me, or how I play? Interesting. Care to throw out any other baseless accusations?

I did not condone a player or players arriving at a S mark (while others are standing by for friends to arrive), and taking it for themselves. I simply stated that it's not against the rules, and the GMs *have* confirmed this.

The GM confirmed that as far as SE and their game is concerned, there is no such things as early pulling, but recognized that players themselves had created this construct of an "early pull". In the same posting, the GM made it clear that any player(s) who attack a mark because they believe they can beat it, is playing the hunt content how it's meant to be played. Further it was clarified with regard to grabbing aggro and resetting a mark, that this practice is in fact in violation of the game's terms since you are interfering with another player's play of the game.

So, I will say it again, as it is true;

There is no such things an an early pull (also confirmed by GM), so if some one wished to try their strength and pulls an S-rank, the others around it have the choice; let the fool die, or join in. Either way it doesn't matter, the point is that there is a target waiting to be attacked, someone has to attack it, and no one is in charge, so no one get's to say "pull now" or "do not pull now".

I am certain you will try to rationalize that someone walking up to a mark and pulling it before others are ready is interfering with another player's play, however in the absence of a claim system, the only 'offense' is a lack of courtesy, especially if the player pulling the mark was not one of those who found it. It was made very clear that a hunt mark in the open that has not yet been engaged is fair game to anyone that wants to have a go, regardless of any informal rules or guidelines the players believe that they have created and can enforce on others.

So, yes, the GMs have confirmed that there is no such thing as an early pull. The fact that GMs are players too, and appreciate the courtesy of those who wait for others before engaging a mark does not in any way affect that statement. What it does do is underline the simple and obvious fact that someone walking up and pulling a hunt mark found by others is behaving in a rude/uncourteous manner. However, that does not in any way fall foul of the games terms of service, in other words (and I am sure we all know this implicitly by now), rude players will not be punished for being rude because it's not an actionable.

I'm sure that folks have been reported for "early pulling", that doesn't make it actionable. If the person pulling the mark goes on to hurl abuse or taunt others over it, that might be actionable, as a GM previously posted, it really comes down to a matter of intent. In the same post I am referring to, it was discussed that yes, it would be possible for a player to play the game within the rule and at the same time be griefing one or more other players. However it was not the one time act of pulling the hunt mark that was the problem, it was the intent and pattern of behavior. Getting at the intent of a player who pulls a mark before others are ready is difficult. You can report that player, and *if* a GM bothers to respond, and approaches the player, it will go something like this;

GM: Why did you pull that S mark while X group was waiting for friends to show up?

If the player was not alone, I imagine their answer will be something like;
Accused Early Puller: Because me and my friends thought we could beat it.

If they were alone, I imagine they will say something like;
Accused Early Puller: I didn't realize they were waiting.
or
Accused Early Puller: I didn't know it was an S, and then everyone joined in.
or
Accused Early Puller: I got too close by accident and when it aggro'd on me, I figured what the hell.

The GM response will be something like;

GM: I see, thank you for your time, enjoy your play.

And that my friend will be the end of the inquiry, at most, the GM might admonish the player for their lack of courtesy, but that's a matter of personal behavior. Unless of course the early puller has said something in chat to incite others about the pull, but that's an entirely different matter, and falls under the category of harassment - which is of course actionable.

Thayos, you're arguing semantics and words with me, your own post confirms everything I said in my original post, except that you are saying that the "early pull" is real, and I stated that there is no such thing. In truth, whether a "pull" was early or not is entirely subjective. There is no universal definition of what constitutes an "early pull" because it's only early if you are not ready for it. So, as I said, there is no such thing as an early pull.

Yes, you can label a "pull" early if someone pulls (by intent or accident) the mark before you or others are ready. That is your personal opinion of the event, it is not an objective fact that the pull was early. As has been pointed out, an S mark can be defeated by a group of 8, if a full party comes along and pulls a mark, before your friends arrive, you'll complain of an early pull. However to the party of 8 that pull and possibly defeat the mark, there was nothing early about it.