Is NIN better job than MNK?

[Ricdeau]

Damn it, i wish someone would tell me that sooner before i did my MNK all to lvl 50 and invested all my poe/sol/cash into him... Why did i have to pick up the class, that is getting rolled over by every mechanic in this game... Like cone aoe behind the boss, say goodbye to your potency, some mechanics, say good bay to your stacks, while NIN and Lancer can laugh at my face... I hope that they will do something regard this matter, it's kinda weird that MNK is the only one that has to bear all that awful stuff.

I'm going to tell you just as I did in the other thread you made about the monk positionals. You just have to learn the bosses, and then most mechanics won't have any great impact on you aside from when you are forced to lose stacks, which is actually pretty rare if you have learned the fight well.

But asking if ninja is a better job than monk is asking if one opinion is better than another. Monk, ninja, and dragoon are all pretty well balanced against each other. In most single target cases monk is going to win in pure damage, and in Final Coil monk utility is very valuable. Ninja and dragoon single target DPS will be pretty close to each other and slightly behind monk in most cases. Ninja brings a lot of versatility to the group, and dragoon bring high burst capability and a buff for bards.

You seem to be really down on learning how to actually handle a monk properly in this thread and the previous one you made so you might be better off looking at ninja. Neither job if played correctly is going to do your party a disservice.

[Viviza]

Neither job is overall better. They're well balanced at the moment.

Monk is the best sustained DPS by a bit, but has strict uptime and positional requirements. Dragon Kick debuffs nearly all the most dangerous attacks in the game and is the best defensive utility a DPS brings to the raid team.

Ninja DPS is excellent and less strict than monk, but requires the player have a connection with low mudra lag to maximize its output. If your ping isn't great you simply cannot be an "excellent" ninja. Trick attack is great for helping with DPS checks, which are what learning groups are often struggling with, so ninja boasts solid utility as well.

[Kuroyasha]

I like both and play both well. I appreciate what they both bring to the table when played at a high level. Some of your complaints in this thread are ones that inexperienced would make, and would become non-issue if one takes the time to become very experienced with the class. For example, any boss, or significant add in an encounter that has a back conal aoe either has enough room for you to still get back atks (like t10 boss), or the cast bar goes fast enough where u can keep your groove(or slow enough where u can get in, hit, get out b4 bar finishes). Fights that force u to disconnect usually have some workaround for u to keep stacks(if executed properly ofc), or the forced 100%-certain-these-stacks-will-fall occurs where u can get em back up with Perfect balance.

Will continue post through edit b/c char limit

Continued: Monk also has dragon kick which is useful in more than just final coil, almost every boss has magical atks that can be lowered while monk is atking. (Expected response from someone: "But dk isnt needed in most fights!" Neither is Trick atk/Goad, but we still use it for its benefits) One also have the ability to switch to a defense stance when big unavoidable dmg is coming and quickly switch back to Fist of Fire if need be(or u noticed u used BFB and Mega/Gigaflare is coming and dont have time to click off with controller ;D ). Furthermore, Monk isnt relying on anyone else to provide buffs for them(like slashing debuff/piercing debuff etc), yet we still reach big deeps.

Ninja is a great class with its own unique adv/disadv as well. Since the change to drg, nin have harshest punishment if ninjutsu mistake is made for whatever reason(honest mistake, instance lag, short lag spike from ISP, etc.). However, Nin dps can reach great heights when played properly. Everyone loves trick atk, tp users love goad. It's similar to monk in dealing with being efficient with faster gcds and keeping those oh-so-important dots up.

One thing that will hold you back is your connection to the server. Mudra lag is real and just downright annoying, esp for ps4 users (like myself) that cant try services like Battleping WTFast etc. Granted I've found ways to at least try to minimize the effect on dps (pulled a new personal high 565 in t11 with lb3 while having exact same gear as my prev high 544 with no lb the previous week), but the fact that I wont be able to maximize nin dps b/c of it is pretty ugh. Dont know why SE would design a class that relies on something they cant control. It's still a fun class however, and im still working on seeing how high I can go with minimal to no mistakes.

Ninjutsus are fun to look at, and animations are smooth (outside of mudra lag). Is Nin better than Monk in terms of dps? Imo theoretically no, however practically they can get extremely close and sometimes(keyword there) pull ahead for the full encounter. Same with DRG after their buff. Either way, you're going to have to practice a lot to truly excel at whichever respective job u choose to play.

[Hakmatic]

DPS wise MNK tops Ninja. The only place where MNK gets his ass handed to him in coil is T13 arguably. But the Dragon Kick though

I dont know what monks you are playing with, but a monk does not get his ass handed to him in t13 or any turn actually.

[Resine]

You seem to be really down on learning how to actually handle a monk properly in this thread and the previous one you made so you might be better off looking at ninja. Neither job if played correctly is going to do your party a disservice.

I think you misunderstood me here and in the other thread, it's not like i am not able to do it, it's more like it is getting on my nerve every time i have to do it. Even more when i see Dragon and NIN almost in the same spot all the time.

[Kuroyasha]

I dont know what monks you are playing with, but a monk does not get his ass handed to him in t13 or any turn actually.

^ this. If it's the monks first time clearing t13 then they may be low since they are getting used to doing everything cleanly while keeping stacks up. Once that is done however, they will be high or at the top like they normally are. Unless they get stuck with every earthshaker in last phase lol (dat rng)

I think you misunderstood me here and in the other thread, it's not like i am not able to do it, it's more like it is getting on my nerve every time i have to do it. Even more when i see Dragon and NIN almost in the same spot all the time.

U can be almost in the same spot too. You dont have to move so far towards middle of back or so far to the left/right for flank, which all goes back to the comment Ricdeau made about being down on handling a monk properly.

[Ricdeau]

I think you misunderstood me here and in the other thread, it's not like i am not able to do it, it's more like it is getting on my nerve every time i have to do it. Even more when i see Dragon and NIN almost in the same spot all the time.

Then you've answered your own question, you should move on from monk. If you don't want to deal with positionals there's other things you can play. However, you stated:

Damn it, i wish someone would tell me that sooner before i did my MNK all to lvl 50 and invested all my poe/sol/cash into him... Why did i have to pick up the class, that is getting rolled over by every mechanic in this game... Like cone aoe behind the boss, say goodbye to your potency, some mechanics, say good bay to your stacks, while NIN and Lancer can laugh at my face... I hope that they will do something regard this matter, it's kinda weird that MNK is the only one that has to bear all that awful stuff.

Monks do not get rolled over by every mechanic. There are extremely few instances where you are forced to lose stacks, and you shouldn't be missing positionals often at all. From the way you state things in this thread and the other you have made it sound like this is something that's difficult for you to do. However, as it stands monk positionals are fine, and when you learn the boss mechanics losing stacks should be something that happens very infrequently except for when it's a total break in combat which impacts everyone to some degree. GL stacks are just the trade off a monk has to except for the extremely high single target damage they do, and you have to learn how to take advantage of every opportunity to keep your combo going and move into each positional.

No class/job will be perfect, and there will be fights that they can't perform their best on. That's just the nature of fight variation, but as it stands right now monk performs exceptionally well on most every encounter in the game.

[Warlyx]

meh monk positionals are ok , but nin mudras are a pain in the rear, playing nin at high ping is so frustrating that i hope SE lessen the mudra thing for the expansion....i loved the idea of mudras and spells..... until u experience lag and then the job goes to the trashcan...

as i said before the mudra is a good idea poorly implemented.

[Slappah]

Honestly monk is just so much more fun at least in my opinion, of course.

I played ninja for awhile and while the rotation by itself was interesting enough to hold my attention...only having 1 positional requirement which you only have to perform once every minute, became stale.

Playing a MNK, it's just so great when you hit that groove and you're switching positions like it's a dance. Rear flank rear flank rear flank, flank, flank, rear, rear, flank.

It's so much more engaging and when you learn it well and have the muscle memory down its just fun. It's really really fun.


I'm still relatively new to monk Ive only been 50 on it for about a week but it's already the highest geared job I have.

[Aeliott]

People say Monk is the hardest job...then a bunch of people say it isn't...I've mained since launch, and while the rotation does become easy muscle memory eventually (easier than drg/nin imo), the real tests lie in knowing the fight and how to maintain stacks and such. Is the enemy going to become untargetable soon? Will I lose a chance to refresh GL if I use Touch of Death before that jump, delaying my form combo? Is it worth eating an aoe or staying longer than is safe if I can retain stacks in exchange? And little nuances like using Demolish's long animation to give you a slightly later GL refresh.

Of course this varies wildly from fight to fight on how difficult this is, and there are some real stinkers (namely the last turns of each coil in particular; 5,9 and 13). But that's something we learn to deal with in practice. As has been said above there is no "best" of the 2 jobs, and both have different kind of learning curves. Just gotta find the one that you're more comfortable with, which sounds like it would likely be NIN.