Repetitive grind parties should NOT be the main source of leveling

[LillithaFenimore]

11 days likely playing 12 hours a day, leave that alone.

LOL is all LOL

[Dargoth_Draconia]

This is a topic I'd really like us to hash out on the forums to get a good idea on where we as a community want the leveling system of this game to go. So let's get down to this discussion and have a good, heated debate where we can fight for what mode of leveling we feel should be implemented in the game (my bias should be clear at this point based on the title ).

My Opinion:
Since the beginning of my MMO trek I've never understood the appeal of repetitive, endless grinding where a group fights the same monsters over and over and over again until they reach the level cap (usually throwing away hours a day). What good does this do the player? Yes, you get really good at killing common monsters about 1000+ times, but how is this content or an acceptable way to explore through a game? Maybe this GETS you to content but the means do not justify the ends. It only promotes reproducing a dim and dull task countless amount of times to reach an end goal. To me this only proves one's ability to have patience and resilience in the face of menial labor (like pulling the same lever at a conveyor belt for your job at a factory every day).

When we play an MMO we want to explore content, immerse ourselves in the story, and feel a sense of community to our fellow players. Grinding can bring us together, but it really becomes something you have to MAKE fun after a while and it becomes mindless and less engaging for a group. People say "oh well you just aren't being creative, we used to play games like 'pull the hate off the tank' or fight really tough mobs' to see if we wipe". These examples should be things we can do REGARDLESS of grind parties and a game shouldn't have its sole basis of leveling made fun by imaginary games invented by the players. There should be some structure.

Mixes of dungeons, group quests with fun objectives, leve parties, and grinding can be great in an MMO but grinding parties alone as the only feasible way to level up fast will only bring back ex-FF11 players who logged around 7 years into the game and no new crowds that can bring this game a healthy population .

To be honest I'm embarassed when I tell people about games like FF11 and FF14 because when I get done talking about all their cool content I cringe when I have to bring the brutal truth of their endless xp grinds that some say make them seem like "work".

I don't understand the appeal to grinding as a main source of leveling, but I'm sure you guys have plenty to say so feel free to bash me down or agree with me. Whatever floats your boat.

Now I want to know what you guys think

*edit
a lot of you seem to think I want solo play to be the best, and most profitable way to level, but I don't. I do believe group methods of leveling up should yield the highest amount of growth =).

Currently there are tons of ways to level up but your die hard MMO fans who love the level up process feel like grinding in camps (like new beastmen camps or even the instances or even roaming parties) goes hand in hand with that process. I understand you don't get it but really the grind parties are about community play, gathering a group of players some friends some not and just going out and killing monsters and having fun. That in itself makes 100% sense to me and to me a Japanese MMO or Korean MMO wouldn't be the same if that wasn't the main source of EXPing. Since everyone refers to WoW I will too in this situation, WoW's main source of leveling up was through quests or running dungeons/instances. (second option mainly applies to tanks and healers) and I am glad FFXIV has finally added some SP gains to all the quests that makes me actually want to do them. I had no desire before to do the quests really for the rewards you get because money is practically useless for the time being.

Part of the immersion for me is the grind for I don't play MMOs for a great storyline because most MMOs lack what I consider a good storyline. FFXIV has the makings for a good storyline but because you get to watch a beautiful cutscene but still have to read text instead of getting voice acting has really killed it for me. I find myself skipping most the CS's and/ or just spamming the button to get through the wall of text you have to read. FFXI CoP expansion had an amazing storyline but the rest of the storylines in FFXI to me was mediocre at best.

Honestly what you are complaining about is only one of the options and is not the only way to level up atm. You can solo grind mobs, party grind, do leves (still great SP from the leves I have done solo and fair SP in a party with full links and personally glad Leves is not the main focus for the grinding that is so boring) and the dungeons provide great SP for SP runs if you get a group that will utilize it for such, IF you just want to grind the mobs fight up the to boss back out reenter in 5 min and start over, the SP gain is great in Dz Darkhold for 45+ if you kill all the mobs. I am sure Toto rak or w/e is good sp for the 25+ as well. For the time being we only have 2 dungeons but we will be getting more dungeons with each new patch and before long we will have a lower level and a higher level dungeon in each area more than likely. Then again killing mobs is the only way to level no matter in what context you do it it, whether it is in a group in a dungeon or doing a level you are still technically grinding on mobs to get SP just in a slightly different form or different objectives tossed in the mix.

[Verecund]

11 days likely playing 12 hours a day, leave that alone.

An IV and a bag of yogurt can do wonders.

[Dargoth_Draconia]

P.S. Content just started to come out give the game some time I am sure they are going to add more than just dungeons with the new outposts being added to the game and the beastmen tribes etc. You should feel happy with the new content that we have gotten that goes to show you they are competent enough to deliver. We will probably see some stuff like Garrison defense and other things in the future.

[Ventus]

I like some of the ideas on here and I think I may as well put an idea i've had that games just don't seem to have, but the post above kind of touches on. The Random Battles thing is a great idea and is classic rpg. I want to see quests focused around the possibility of Ambushes. Imagine this:

You go up to an NPC just outside the city and are given a very specific quest. A family is attempting to make its way from Ul'Dah to the ferry boats, but are fearful of potential attacks. Because of this, they ask for a party of bodyguards to escort the family (which would be in the form of a slow moving wagon pulled by a chocobo) along the road all the way to the destination. As you escort this wagon, you not only have to defend from the aggroing mobs already out on the map, but also quest specific party ambushes (I see it more of an ambush if theres no huge yellow circle on the map). These mob parties would have an actual strategic party, like a healer+dps+tank that your party has to adapt to in order to defeat. Your reward is based on how damaged the wagon is.

That's my crazy idea, and how fun would that be. =]

That could be a really fun challenge =). Escort objectives have always been really tough for me in RPGs but enjoyable and rewarding to complete ^^

[odette]

my ideal for rank up, is SE put more dificult quest, grinding party is boring, what effort??? you only kill same mob 1000 000
we live in 2011 no 1997
SE need change it, if they wanna have more players in this game in the future

[Deceptistar]

my ideal for rank up, is SE put more dificult quest, grinding party is boring, what effort??? you only kill same mob 1000 000
we live in 2011 no 1997
SE need change it, if they wanna have more players in this game in the future

Im actually pretty happy SE doesnt make the leveling system like the 78927602578 MMO's out there where you just talk to a NPC, do a short quest, and they hand you 1 level worth of EXP

[Shadren]

Im actually pretty happy SE doesnt make the leveling system like the 78927602578 MMO's out there where you just talk to a NPC, do a short quest, and they hand you 1 level worth of EXP

Yeah, they put in long quests which make you run across the world and back for level 1 experience. Good game SE.

[Rimmer]

Im actually pretty happy SE doesnt make the leveling system like the 78927602578 MMO's out there where you just talk to a NPC, do a short quest, and they hand you 1 level worth of EXP

What MMO gives you 1 level worth of XP with 1 quest?

[Verecund]

What MMO gives you 1 level worth of XP with 1 quest?

Whereas in this game you get handed 4 levels XD