Locked out of the Duty Finder.

[Andevom]

Personally, I'm fine with it. I've been slammed with the penalty and just waited it out, no big deal. In the grand scheme of things, it *is* preventing massive withdrawals from happening too often.

That said, I think NyarukoW is being unreasonable about this, and I can understand why people want changes. So long as the problem is still prevented by any changes made, I'll still be happy.

[NyarukoW]

... is being unreasonable about this....

It is unreasonable to support a good decision and implementation that SE has done. Really? SE is quite reasonable in their approach and implementation. It is too lenient in my opinion, but I am not arguing for more stringent criteria.

.. Cherry picking one post that disagrees with me ..

I am not cherry picking. There are plenty more see:

This might mean clearly watch who you party with. I agree with the way it is working is as intended. As other people in this thread have said, it should be even stricter but at least it's something. How do you prevent a party from constantly withdrawal from frontlines to promote wintrading? you lock the whole party out that's doing it. Sorry but there is no other way.

This is why you get two free "strikes" with no 30 minute penalty, exactly because Things Happen and emergencies come up. If you find yourself in a situation where you're going to be repeatedly interrupted and are worried about hitting the third strike and taking a 30-minute penalty, perhaps it's not the best time to queue up and you should do something else until the potential for interruptions passes?

I don't see why this is even an issue. This can all be easily avoided by the simple step of performing a Ready Check before you queue up for DF.

Now, if you do that, and someone still withdraws once it pops? Then they're being a jerk, and you know who not to invite to a party again.

And many more from this thread alone. The one that are unreasonable are the ones coming here making up all sorts of odd hypotheticals and then getting all worked up with false self-indignation about that hypothetical 1 strikes they should not get forgetting the fact that the system is lenient with 3 strikes and the penalty is all too light 30 minutes.

[Tiggy]

It is unreasonable to support a good decision and implementation that SE has done. Really? SE is quite reasonable in their approach and implementation. It is too lenient in my opinion, but I am not arguing for more stringent criteria.

It's unreasonable to brow beat people over and over trying to make them agree with you. You're first sentence is a good example of how you're unreasonable. You immediately assume it's a good decision despite people vehemently disagreeing. They way you ignore the opinions of others and continue to assert your own regardless of what they think is why you're entirely unreasonable. You're opinion isn't the only valid one. Every complaint in this thread is valid and square will take it into consideration even if you wont. Posting three examples of people who like it doesn't change the fact there are plenty of people here don't like it as well. You need to accept that people have different opinions from you.

[Andevom]

It is unreasonable to support a good decision and implementation that SE has done. Really?

That wouldn't be unreasonable, no. However, that's not what you're doing.

[Ashkendor]

Clearly you missed the part where I said no argument would convince me. It's my opinion that it's too much. Others here obviously agree. Your opinion is not the only valid or important one. Deal with it.

The existence and length of this thread is a cornucopia of reasons why your wrong.

You need to accept that people have different opinions from you.

You also need to accept this, apparently.

[NyarukoW]

That wouldn't be unreasonable, no. However, that's not what you're doing.

In what way am I not showing support for SE? Pray tell please. I have made abundantly clear that I applaud and agree with this change on DF, and I instruct people in my FC to ready check and queue and do not withdraw.

... Every complaint in this thread is valid....

Really only this thread? How about every thread, including those with complaints about clear sellers, RMT, lack of help for new/newer players, trouble forming statics, vote kick abuse for watching cutscenes, speed runner vote kick abuse of slower players etc., etc. Those are all valid too, actually they are a lot more valid than crying about a system with built-in safeties and really mild 30 penalty after the 3rd strike with a reset of strike count every day.

[Tiggy]

I accept it just fine. I'm not coming into this thread after every single person who likes the fix and telling them they're wrong. I'm telling Nyaraku specifically he's wrong for telling me and others why their opinions are wrong. There is a difference.

Really only this thread? How about every thread, including those with complaints about clear sellers, RMT, lack of help for new/newer players. Those are all valid too.

There is a difference between saying your opinion once and moving on and posting after every single post in a thread brow beating your opinion over everyone's head. You ignore all other opinions, denounce any credibility of those opinions, and then reassert yours as the only correct opinion refusing any actual discussion on the topic that might disagree with your original assertion. There world isn't as black and white or us vs them like you continue to make it out to be. This is why you're unreasonable and in every thread you go off in people have issues with you.

[Ashkendor]

I accept it just fine. I'm not coming into this thread after every single person who likes the fix and telling them they're wrong. I'm telling Nyaraku specifically he's wrong for telling me and others why their opinions are wrong. There is a difference.

His opinion differs from yours. Just leave it at that instead of engaging in a pointless argument where neither one of you is going to convince the other that they're right. You're both entitled to your opinion. *shrug*

[Giantbane]

Why not? If you want to raid successfully, sometimes you need to help people sort out their mumble, TS, etc. If the network lag issues can't be resolved it will be impossible to have them in your static. Be proactive and help solve the problems that you can.

We're talking about very casual content here, not raid content since this only applies to content you can do as a partial group. If it happens once, that's 1 strike down for the day. If a person misclicks or there's an emergency or something else happens, whether it's their fault or not. There is no incentive to help and all the incentive to just leave or boot that member out to prevent a 2nd strike. That's not very conducive to casual grouping.

If 1 person is causing a problem, whether their internet is poor, they're queuing and walking away, misclicking or whatever, they accumulate the strikes. They will get put on time out if they're unlucky or misbehaving or whatever. There's no need to involve the rest of the group in this because the rest of the group isn't responsible for the problem.

The overriding problem here is ... the persistent trolling and fishing on the DF.

How can you keep repeating this when we're talking about groups. There is nothing to fish for as a group, and it's absolutely no easier to troll as a group than it is solo. If the overriding problem doesn't exist for groups, why do groups need special collective strikes?

[Ashkendor]

How can you keep repeating this when we're talking about groups. There is nothing to fish for as a group, and it's absolutely no easier to troll as a group than it is solo. If the overriding problem doesn't exist for groups, why do groups need special collective strikes?

It *does* open the door to trolling things for groups, though. Put a partial together. Queue as partial, withdraw, have a few cheap giggles. Pass off lead, rinse, repeat. Honestly, if people wouldn't have been trolling queues and/or fishing for in progress (you can't queue for JIP as a group, but it still has to be taken into account) we wouldn't need something like this. I don't think SE is to blame for it; the people that were doing it were.