2.41 patch, Ninja nerf for the Ninjas and Dungeons.

[SpookyGhost]

You have to manage keeping Shadow Edge, Dancing Edge, and Mutilate up while being able to get one Aeolian Edge in before you have to reapply all of them again. Two Aeolian Edge's if a WAR is handling the slash buff for you, then you can ignore Dancing Edge.

Take what I say with a grain of salt as I haven't leveled NIN and only roughly know how it works based on vids and my friends who play the job at end game, but that just sounds like a standard rotation. It actually seems like a priority system, similar to DRG.

Then you have your mudra which feels like a completely separate mechanic on it's own. Always keeping Huton up and able to do a Trick Attack and Raiton before having to reapply Huton, keeping heavy surveillance of your bar (2 Raitons if you have Kassatsu up).

I actually think Mudras are pretty sweet since it's sort of like Wrath for WAR. It's a new mechanic for melee that people will have to learn and get down to muscle memory, which does give it a bit of a steep learning curve. Messing up a Huton will definitely severely gimp your DPS for the duration that your Mudras are down, and while MNK has it's own unique mechanic in GL3, losing it is fairly hard to do unless the boss jumps or your keyboard catches on fire. However, I do think this is similar to DRG missing a positional, especially Heavy Thrust. Missing either HT or Disembowel basically ruins your entire (long) rotation, and you can either continue it hoping that eventually it patches up or you have to start all over. If a boss stays perfectly still, I'd say Mudras require a bit more work as you do have to pay attention to when they come back up. If a boss is twisting and turning, I'd say things either even out or are in DRG's favor, as DRG is then required to know when the boss will turn to not attempt going for a HT and ending up hitting the rear or Disembowling the flank.

I'd say NIN is definitely different than the other 2 melee. All have their own unique things to deal with, and I'd say they're all on relatively equal footing. MNK has it a bit easier than both as missing a positional just means a single loss in potency, but neither MNK nor DRG should really be missing their positionals.

Anyway, would just be cool if all the melee were roughly on par with eachother. Give DRG some Utility, buff MDef, slightly more potency on stuff just to bring it up a bit and everything's square.

... Enix.

[Ophie-Mio]

Then why not post on the account you DO play? Hiding behind an alt just invalidates the point you're trying to make.

Because they don't want to admit to the internet that they don't have an alt. I see that all the time. 100 soldiery bonus in Second coil farm parties? "Oh, this is my alt." Oh? So why do you keep dying?

Good try, Nalien.

[Skyl1n3]

Ninja is fine the way it is.

<- Totally not a biased Ninja :3

[RaizeGraymalkin]

This thread scared the hell out of me. They better not nerf them just because people seem to think they're OP (mostly Dragoons).

[Ophie-Mio]

But they are kinda OP. I was in a Titan HM the other day and the Ninja literally said that he was thankful for the movement speed buff because it made dodging the weights easier.

I just think that maybe because it's new that SE put A LOT of love into the class/job. Maybe too much. Why give a class an obvious advantage such as lesser fall damage? Why can't a healer have that? Why the new class? Why not a movement speed buff to help Mnks keep up their stacks? Why just the new class? Oh, and on top of that, they don't need to worry about positionals at all.

Just my opinion that I think that SE threw a few too many bonuses/abilities in the NIN bag. A nerf to their skills/abilities like how Bard's Rain of Death worked would be nice. As it stands, correctly played NINs are just too good.

[DoctorPepper]

But they are kinda OP. I was in a Titan HM the other day and the Ninja literally said that he was thankful for the movement speed buff because it made dodging the weights easier.

I just think that maybe because it's new that SE put A LOT of love into the class/job. Maybe too much. Why give a class an obvious advantage such as lesser fall damage? Why can't a healer have that? Why the new class? Why not a movement speed buff to help Mnks keep up their stacks? Why just the new class? Oh, and on top of that, they don't need to worry about positionals at all.

The movement speed buff ninja gets is equivalent to the fists of wind buff that monk can give themselves, so mnk actually does get a movement speed buff, they just have to give up a dps buff (fists of fire) to use it.

In addition to that, ninja loses an additional trait to falling damage which is 100% useless. I'm not sure how you find that useful at all, there's not a single fight in this game that would utilize fall damage.

As for positionals, you don't necessarily have to worry about them, but dancing edge does significantly more damage when used from the targets flank.

[Ophie-Mio]

The movement speed buff ninja gets is equivalent to the fists of wind buff that monk can give themselves, so mnk actually does get a movement speed buff, they just have to give up a dps buff (fists of fire) to use it.

Keeping in mind that I only have a baby rogue but that my friends who have leveled it also main DRG and MNk, if what you're saying is the truth here then why does that need to happen this way?
Why can't NIN also lose out on something to achieve the buff?

And it's not that the fall damage is useful it's just that it's one more thing on top of a list already quite stacked. Why? Just cause we want them to take lesser damage for some reason.

[CGMidlander]

In addition to that, ninja loses an additional trait to falling damage which is 100% useless. I'm not sure how you find that useful at all, there's not a single fight in this game that would utilize fall damage.

There's some limited utility for it in Frontlines, but yeah it's generally not too useful.

[DoctorPepper]

Keeping in mind that I only have a baby rogue but that my friends who have leveled it also main DRG and MNk, if what you're saying is the truth here then why does that need to happen this way?
Why can't NIN also lose out on something to achieve the buff? Maybe I'm just not understanding how it works.

Monk and Dragoon both get traits that improve abilities they use in place of the movement speed trait nin gets (useful I agree) and the falling damage trait nin gets (100% useless). It's a trade off of utility, nothing more.

If you're curious about the movement speed buff that nin gets, please watch this video. It's not as OP as people think it is but it's definitely useful for movement heavy fights such as titan ex.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r45fccScTw4
This one includes a monk with fists of wind up (1st is ninja, 3rd is monk):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RfKqPFmuLbY

[AkashiXI]

I said this in another thread, and not sure if I'm going to parrot anyone here already, but if they give Trick Attack a similar lockout like Virus' antibody, that'll definitely help out in terms of balance. Right now there's virtually no penalty in stacking Ninjas and Monks, while there is with every other job. Ninja's utility is on par with Bard (if the healers don't need ballad, which they don't need after they master whichever endgame content, killing Bard out of the equation unless it's for first time progression), and their utility is much better than Dragoon's due to Trick Attack and Goad. Putting TA on a 60sec CD on the mob will even this out.