Thread: 2.41 patch, Ninja nerf for the Ninjas and Dungeons.

Originally Posted by Nalien

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I like how that this guy does not even have Rogue unlocked yet and telling people if the job is easy or hard.

I won't say Ninja is more difficult than MNK or DRG, but it definitely comes with it's own hardships. You have to manage keeping Shadow Edge, Dancing Edge, and Mutilate up while being able to get one Aeolian Edge in before you have to reapply all of them again. Two Aeolian Edge's if a WAR is handling the slash buff for you, then you can ignore Dancing Edge. Then you have your mudra which feels like a completely separate mechanic on it's own. Always keeping Huton up and able to do a Trick Attack and Raiton before having to reapply Huton, keeping heavy surveillance of your bar (2 Raitons if you have Kassatsu up). Doesn't all sound too bad, but dealing with a boss with a lot of mechanics can make keeping up all of this very difficult. Screw up a Huton once, that is a gigantic DPS loss for 20 seconds, -20- seconds. Not to mention, the mudra being laggy because the game does not register a .5sec GCD very well. Even with a low ping and latency, it is a big issue still and something SE needs to fix.

I don't care about nerfing NIN in PvE, they're great. They just make it super obvious how poorly DRG was implemented in comparison, but at least SE is working on that.

Btw, Monk is still the top DPS for single target and the damage difference between Ninja and Dragoon is minimal.

Just to clarify, MNK is still top DPS for single target dmg, yes. But I assume no one adds in their extra damage produced by Trick Attack to the DPS that NIN brings to the table? I think it's a bit underestimated between extra tank damage and 3 DPS damage for 10 seconds every 60 seconds add up quite a lot and may even push them pretty close to MNK, honestly.

But for PVP, yeah no, that. They nerfed BLM into the ground, gave healers a lot nerfs (most justifiable for sure), NIN stands out to me as the biggest melee threat.

DRG can't keep up with me with their infrequent jumps. MNK is only a threat with 3 greased lightning stacks and my CC on WHM lets me interrupt that most of the time. NIN can keep up with movement speed, doesn't need any stacks of anything, has burst long range AND close-range attacks, has a stun/silence, and high attack speed to keep those guaranteed interrupts going, a gap closer, and what, 3 potential DoTs? And the trick attack vuln down has a huge impact on taking a healer/caster down for the party. Can you tell I'm salty-balls about them? Lmao. Playing a mage can be frustrating enough, lawd.

Originally Posted by Nalien

Well, I don't think we really disagreed anyway, more misunderstood. I disagreed with another posters notion than Ninja and Monk are harder than Dragoon, and the only reason anyone could claim Ninja is hard is Ninjutsu latency. Sitting on a mobs rear is not hard, after all. Nor is weaving between flank and rear, for that matter, but whatever.

As i've played MNK before NIN gets out, i can say that,as mnk, it an easily job as long as you remember the rotation, just keep doing it you wont fail on it.
As Ninja, it's another pairs of hands, you can't use a single rotation (it's more a priority check) as you have to use Mudra as soon as possible, and you have to check every buff/skills if they are up to add extra damage.
So, while as nin your eyes are focus on the buff/skills/dots as mnk i was focusing more on the battlefield.

It's easy to play ninja, it's hard to keep an eyes on everything as ninja and if you can't follow the battlefield while doing your job, then you're gonna loose in DPS.

Ninja isn't hard to play. There is a set rotation just like every other class and once you learn it the class becomes simple.

As for ninjutsu,
Huton -> Suiton-> (Kass+Raiton/Doton)-> Raiton/Doton -> Repeat

I've also never had trouble with mudra combos. Learn to queue your spells and stop button mashing.

Also, the excuse of boss mechanics is bad. You can ninjutsu while moving, Huton is applied to you, Raiton is long range and Suiton's buff lasts for 10 seconds.

Originally Posted by Nalien

Ninja is the Bard of melee DPS. Anyone who thinks it is a difficult Job to play needs to stop deluding themselves...

Originally Posted by Hammerfist

Lol nope, Ninja is already the hardest DPS class in the game and wanting to make it even harder for the sake of "balance" is an absolute nonsense.

Btw, Monk is still the top DPS for single target and the damage difference between Ninja and Dragoon is minimal.

minimal? lol

on top of being better just about everywhere else except aoe/self hp sustain, they definitely have recognizably higher dps (more than 5%). not to mention TA typically has better raid dps contribution than disembowel, depending on how well your BRD is doing vs the rest of the raid

the icing on the cake really is that a DRG has to play perfectly with positionals to perform suboptimal melee DPS. one missed HT/ID is going to cost you a ton of your already poor melee DPS, while NIN/MNK have the room to play a lot more leniently without being heavily penalized.