A public test server is needed now more than ever.

[Sonic_the_Hedgehog]

Didn't Yoshi-P say they were going to have a PTS after they finish revamping the game?

[sruon]

The amount of people that are against PTS is astounding, the benefits of having one far outweighs the drawbacks.

FFXI is hardly a good reference for those things.

[Wolfie]

[*]Every server is a test server right now

I posted my thoughts on this earlier. It's poor practice to treat servers now like they're test realms, because they're trying to regain customer trust and because the longer they wait to add a PTS, the harder it will get. When they go for serious retail service (if they haven't already), they're going to be hard pressed to find the time to set up a PTS.

[*]People will complain about lack of polish no matter the state of testing

Yes. But some of those complaints are actually valid, and if they can make it so that a patch gets released on live servers with more polish than not, it would be stupid to release it unpolished.

[*]changes to game code on a test server don't always reflect the same in full release

What? This makes no sense at all. The point of a PTS is that it's identical to a live server, so that people can test how it would be on live servers. Programming code doesn't just magically do something different if you move it between machines -- unless of course one machine simply cannot execute a line of code. And if that's the case, the program crashes.

But a PTS would be identical to a live server in terms of hardware and software.

[*]Some people like to be the first to make a good strategy and be rewarded. Not play it on the public test realm until you have it down to a science for the public release

That is a disadvantage, kind of. But let me ask you this: why is it that only a PTS would ruin that experience? People will get it down to a science on live realms regardless. Is it that huge if they get it done a few weeks ahead of time?

What if you, specifically, don't partake in the content on the PTS? Does it cheapen it for you still? If yes, does content get cheapened for you if someone figures out the strategy to a T on live servers before you? If no, why does that not bother you, but it would if they got it on a PTS?

This is no different than a beta test. Do you not beta test games? Do games become cheaper for you if some people beta test them?

[*]People hate change and this wont stop complaints.

Of course not. But it will still help bring more polish to patches. If you're going to nerf a class, they're going to whine regardless. But with a PTS, you might catch some bugs in your nerf, or might realize that you overdid it, and fix it before it hits live servers and you have to wait for the next patch cycle to fix it.

[*]This wont help developers "Balance" anything any faster than they are now

Debatable. It might not help them do it faster, but it will help them find some things that they would not be able to find on their own, or see things from a different perspective.

[*]Other reasons I could go on forever.

Please do, I want people to realize what kinds of benefits and disadvantages this system would have. I'm going to analyze whatever it is people post thoroughly.

Public test realms are in my opinion nothing but giant spoilers, they serve no purpose whatsoever other than to let a select peice of the population in on content others don't get to experience for a few more weeks.

Hell I'd rather play content with a few bugs than have it held back from me so people can whine about how easy "_____" Content is or how badly nerfed "____" Job was. Before I even get a chance to test the changes myself.

Just because WoW does it, doesn't mean it's a great idea.

But it's PUBLIC. Everyone can participate, or refuse to participate. There is no "select playerbase" that gets to see this before everyone else. There is no exclusivity here.

[Physic]

Public test servers are redundant and useless for following reasons.

1. Every server is a test server right now
2. People will complain about lack of polish no matter the state of testing
3. changes to game code on a test server don't always reflect the same in full release
4. Some people like to be the first to make a good strategy and be rewarded. Not play it on the public test realm until you have it down to a science for the public release
5. People hate change and this wont stop complaints.
6. This wont help developers "Balance" anything any faster than they are now
7. Other reasons I could go on forever.

Public test realms are in my opinion nothing but giant spoilers, they serve no purpose whatsoever other than to let a select peice of the population in on content others don't get to experience for a few more weeks.

Hell I'd rather play content with a few bugs than have it held back from me so people can whine about how easy "_____" Content is or how badly nerfed "____" Job was. Before I even get a chance to test the changes myself.

Just because WoW does it, doesn't mean it's a great idea.

you miss the point of test servers, its not to create a perfecrly polished patch with no bugs, its to catch some of the bugs, and most importantly to test balances and exploits. Only through people playing will they really see what is up, internal testing is never enough. Also a test server you can break it, reset it, alter it, make buggy as hell, experiment with new things BEFORE they go into the official game.

I have seen games with good test servers, and they tend to be able to create more balanced content. Adding the test server after they figure out how to fix the game doesnt serve as much purpose.

Now if they actually treated this as a test server and did rapid updates and tried stuff and got feedback, i would say its cool, but they dont, they spend months internally testing and come out with balance issues reg players spot on day one. full of bugs and system specific crashes and errors.

It would be better i think, but only if they are actually going to use whatever feedback they get, and rapidly update and fix the test servers and try new things.

[Wolfie]

It would be better i think, but only if they are actually going to use whatever feedback they get, and rapidly update and fix the test servers and try new things.

There is that too. The impression I've been consistently getting from the devs is that they're either really slow or really swamped with work. I can't say with certainty that if they put in a PTS, that they would be able to use even majority of the feedback or that they would be able to do rapid builds on it for testing.

[Ilean]

Now if they actually treated this as a test server and did rapid updates and tried stuff and got feedback, i would say its cool, but they dont, they spend months internally testing and come out with balance issues reg players spot on day one.

This ^ = /THREAD

[Jynx]

But it's PUBLIC. Everyone can participate, or refuse to participate. There is no "select playerbase" that gets to see this before everyone else. There is no exclusivity here.

Oh but it isn't for everyone. It's for those who happen to get in before the test realm is full.

[Ilean]

Oh but it isn't for everyone. It's for those who happen to get in before the test realm is full.

Which is a fairly representative sample of the general server population.

[Wolfie]

Oh but it isn't for everyone. It's for those who happen to get in before the test realm is full.

I've almost never seen that happen with WOW's PTRs, because there's actually very few people who WANT to play on PTRs. Most that are interested in the upcoming content only log in to check it out once or simply stick to reading patch notes and forum posts about the features.

But that's all pointless because whatever progress people make on PTRs is going to get wiped. None of it makes it to live servers. It quite literally does not affect you in any way.

[Jynx]

Well you can be of your opinion then and I can be of mine. My opinion is that PTR's are useless in the long run for the reasons above.

If I have any others I'll be sure to post them, in my opinion the positives are outwieghed highly by the negative.