SE, can you test the damn patch b4 releasing it?

[Hotohori]

I honestly did not want to comment about the MP cost changes but this topic is very clear that there is a situation where both sides of the argument are right. On one side there is an opinion that the change was balanced but this opinion is coming from the side where the player is often rank 50 mage and physical level 50 (character is well developed). The opposing side is in severe dissatisfaction with the change and are often a mage of low to mid rank and not physical level 50. I myself have tested the new cure costs recently and even observed my friend play her rank 13 conjurer with physical level 16 this morning.

My opinion on the MP change is that it is balanced, but not for any character that is not well developed in skills and physical level prior to the change. I have many mp recovery tools at my disposal and excess skill points to distribute to mind if needed. The change of cost to cures did not effect my game play greatly in any way. My friend has 400 hp and 430 mp as I saw today and she was struggling to kill monsters of equal rank and severely slow in mp recovery. She does not have Thaumaturge even unlocked and asking how her stat distribution was set, I realized she did not even have any points to really remove from her other stats to add into vitality or mind.

The MP change was surely not balanced with an underdeveloped character in mind. It was balanced with the ideal of how strongly a factor it would be for a high ranked, high leveled character with optimized skills and gear. My friends gear was very good because I personally crafted them for her and the amount of damage she received at her rank in proportion to the amount of healing she required was not fair in the least. Mages will get hit hard is simply the truth and when soloing, it is a factor that needs to be considered.

The concerns that I have for post 1.19 with the soon removal of the physical level system is that there will be a new wave of low to mid rank mage players who will feel their capabilities have been reduced further through the fact that their formerly physical level 50 characters have only the stat point totals of their rank 20 mage class to spend into attributes. When you have 500 points to allocate onto a rank 20 class, nothing is difficult to kill still honestly regardless of class.

My current opinion about battle post 1.18 would be something like so.
1) Mages are now very inefficient soloists who have the most difficult circumstances of to overcome in battle. Mage classes are now highly dependent on another to ease or make proficient use of time to skill up. (it's overall a lot slower if character is not well developed enough to be self proficient.)
2) Melee classes are overly easy in comparison with increase accuracy and reduced input through auto attack. If I wanted to, my lancer could stand and attack a monster in party and never pull hate by simply not using skills while providing substantial dps for the group. My damage may not be optimized but chances are my emnity will not rise greater then an attentive tank + healer.

Again this is just my opinion from what I felt playing as these classes and could easily be argued by other peoples opinions equally. My mage class ranks are 46 conjurer and 32 thaumaturge while my friend is 13 conjurer with no thaumaturge. Watching her play today reminded me of how hard it was to start as a tarutaru black mage in final fantasy 11 back in 2002 without having a white mage sub job. If you can remember how that experience felt originally back then, you can probably relate to the current situation for a low/underdeveloped mage is feeling now in final fantasy 14 but without a suitable party outlet of experiencing afterwards.

[DoubleEcho]

The concerns that I have for post 1.19 with the soon removal of the physical level system is that there will be a new wave of low to mid rank mage players who will feel their capabilities have been reduced further through the fact that their formerly physical level 50 characters have only the stat point totals of their rank 20 mage class to spend into attributes. When you have 500 points to allocate onto a rank 20 class, nothing is difficult to kill still honestly regardless of class.

As it is now, if you are Rank 20 CON and Phys level 50, you can't pump all of your points into MND and get the same amount you would as 50 CON. There's a stat point limit per rank.

http://ffxiv.zam.com/forum.html?foru...242505663&h=50

If you're talking about something different I apologize. But removing physical levels wouldn't make it too much worse I believe. I do think there will be some issues though, especially if they take away the ability to adjust your attribute points. For example there would be a max MP for R50 CON/THM shared by everyone since you won't be able to pump 174 points into MND. But I feel that this is where Materia Crafting will come into play, as +MND gear would be favored by mages.

[Hotohori]

As it is now, if you are Rank 20 CON and Phys level 50, you can't pump all of your points into MND and get the same amount you would as 50 CON. There's a stat point limit per rank.

http://ffxiv.zam.com/forum.html?foru...242505663&h=50

If you're talking about something different I apologize. But removing physical levels wouldn't make it too much worse I believe. I do think there will be some issues though, especially if they take away the ability to adjust your attribute points. For example there would be a max MP for R50 CON/THM shared by everyone since you won't be able to pump 174 points into MND. But I feel that this is where Materia Crafting will come into play, as +MND gear would be favored by mages.

I'm very aware of the hard caps for HP and MP with vitality and mind but the simple fact is even a rank 20 CON with maximized mind stat for that rank is still a piss poor amount of MP in comparison to the new costs of cure. The amount of stat points for a physical level 20 is no where near the amount you possess as a physical level 50 which is able to at least soft cap every stat for the class with a simple balanced distribution. The removal of physical levels will reduce the total stat points allowed for allocation based on the rank of the class. A rank 20 conjurer will soon have the stat point totals of a physical level 20 to use on that class post 1.19. Also mind and vitality stats attributed from gear and conversion traits currently do not yield any HP or MP.

Basically when physical level is gone, they said that each class total stat points available for distribution will be dependent on the rank of the class instead. Rank 20 conjurer/physical level 50 will soon be rank 20 conjurer/physical level 20 without the physical level part being stated which will be a reduction in power for most players.

[Noir]

I honestly did not want to comment about the MP cost changes but this topic is very clear that there is a situation where both sides of the argument are right. On one side there is an opinion that the change was balanced but this opinion is coming from the side where the player is often rank 50 mage and physical level 50 (character is well developed). The opposing side is in severe dissatisfaction with the change and are often a mage of low to mid rank and not physical level 50. I myself have tested the new cure costs recently and even observed my friend play her rank 13 conjurer with physical level 16 this morning.

My opinion on the MP change is that it is balanced, but not for any character that is not well developed in skills and physical level prior to the change. I have many mp recovery tools at my disposal and excess skill points to distribute to mind if needed. The change of cost to cures did not effect my greatly in any way. My friend has 400 hp and 430 mp as I saw today and she was struggling to kill monsters of equal rank and severely slow in mp recovery. She does not have Thaumaturge even unlocked and asking how her stat distribution was set, I realized she did not even have any points to really remove from her other stats to add into vitality or mind.

The MP change was surely not balanced with an underdeveloped character in mind. It was balanced with the ideal of how strongly a factor it would be for a high ranked, high leveled character with optimized skills and gear. My friends gear was very good because I personally crafted them for her and the amount of damage she received at her rank in proportion to the amount of healing she required was not fair in the least. Mages will get hit hard is simply the truth and when soloing, it is a factor that needs to be considered.

The concerns that I have for post 1.19 with the soon removal of the physical level system is that there will be a new wave of low to mid rank mage players who will feel their capabilities have been reduced further through the fact that their formerly physical level 50 characters have only the stat point totals of their rank 20 mage class to spend into attributes. When you have 500 points to allocate onto a rank 20 class, nothing is difficult to kill still honestly regardless of class.

My current opinion about battle post 1.18 would be something like so.
1) Mages are now very inefficient soloists who have the most difficult circumstances of to overcome in battle. Mage classes are now highly dependent on another to ease or make proficient use of time to skill up. (it's overall a lot slower if character is not well developed enough to be self proficient.)
2) Melee classes are overly easy in comparison with increase accuracy and reduced input through auto attack. If I wanted to, my lancer could stand and attack a monster in party and never pull hate by simply not using skills while providing substantial dps for the group. My damage may not be optimized but chances are my emnity will not rise greater then an attentive tank + healer.

Again this is just my opinion from what I felt playing as these classes and could easily be argued by other peoples opinions equally. My mage class ranks are 46 conjurer and 32 thaumaturge while my friend is 13 conjurer with no thaumaturge. Watching her play today reminded me of how hard it was to start as a tarutaru black mage in final fantasy 11 back in 2002 without having a white mage sub job. If you can remember how that experience felt originally back then, you can probably relate to the current situation for a low/underdeveloped mage is feeling now in final fantasy 14 but without a suitable party outlet of experiencing afterwards.

It's not good either with lvl 50/50. That I can tell. Worse for developing chars. I just ask. Why change what's working for 70% of te users, and then add mana pots and mana gear with materia? Just to try to fix what's working.? It doesn't make any sense for me, and I bet that's what they will do.