Black Mage Novus

[HaroldSaxon]

Your talking about "facts" and other people "talking rubbish".

Your "facts" are theory's and the "talking rubbish" is when people disagree with you.

As Numenor1379 say's there is a lot more involved in real world situations that you "facts" and "maths" don't take into account.

In my opinion all these "facts" are of little value without some real world numbers to back them up.

What dps are you doing on real world content that "matters" (t6/8/9, primals) with your "superior" build/rotation? How many Bards?

My facts are not theories, they are hard numbers that have been calculated by Puro and a few others that have helped him. They also come from end game experience. The "rubbish" is from people claiming things that are disputed by hard facts and experience.

T6 - 410
T7 - if I didn't need to stop DPS constantly due to the fight, I could easily beat 400
T8 - Highest i've achieved is 440
T9 - I've not parsed myself but I can get you one when I run again on Tuesday. That said, i'll freely admit i've only just started downing it and optimising myself for the fight.

Levi - 370
Ramuh - Depending on chaotics, 410 is the highest i've got
Mog - Not about DPS, about controlled DPS like T7.

With groups I have 1 bard and the only time I ever really get a foe's is at the start of the fight, or at the end when we're burning.

I've actually recently transferred to your server, so if you want to go do some Ramuh i'm more than happy to show you. I'm still missing a number of pieces (e.g. i115 weapon) so I know I can push higher.

[scarebearz]

snip

The "hard facts" that were "calculated" do not take into account many factors that come into play in real world situations.

While the stat weights *may* be correct for a perfect rotation on a stationary object, they won't be the same for each encounter.

I'm also using an i110 weapon (UAT) and for coil also have 1 bard with Foes at the start.

T6 - I've done 420, but average about 410.
T7 - Like you say, it's useless for comparison, due to forced dps stops.
T8 - I've done 444, but average around 435-440
T9 - Last kill I was on 381, but did have paralyse at 1 point during the final phase, as someone messed up a thunder xD

So the dps is pretty similar, yet I'm using what is in your opinion a poorer rotation, poorer build and weaker accessories. (I do agree the crafted gears can be nice with crazy melds, but imo not worth the gil over i110)

I've actually recently transferred to your server

I know, I tried to say hello and welcome you to Odin, but my PM seemed to be ignored xD

[Numenor1379]

For Black Mage Novus, should I go all out Det + Crits or Det + Spell Speed for BiS? New to Black Mage, just want big number when casting.

I'm just confused about all this Status thing, can someone who is Blackmage have Novus Tell me what you insert?

44 SSPD, 23 DET, 8 PIE here.

A) The question of this thread was BIS. This is for theoretical BIS.

How is my responding with what I put on my Novus NOT responding to the question here Harold? Learn to read.

B) The whole premise that people make up that spellspeed isn't good in real fights is absolute crap. Why? If you have to cancel a cast when running on spellspeed, you are going to have to with any other build. In fact, you get MORE utility out of spellspeed due to lower cast times (can finish your casts quicker), better movement (cast clipping) as well as the dps advantage it brings

Again, show me a post where I have said SSPD isn't optimal? I maxed my SSPD on my Novus on purpose. You're purposely ignoring what I say, while going off on tangents that have no bearing on what my statements were about.

C) I do great DPS with my build in the real world with my Spellspeed build. I run my i110 weapon, i110 gloves, i110 feet, i110 neck. The rest are melded crafted pieces.

Congrats, you've got millions to spend on gear that gives marginal DPS increases over other gear which can complete said content just as easily. I'm i110 myself with unweathered Soldiery gear, some HA stuff from T6, and my Novus. I can clear any content that I've learned without problems with my gear and push over 400dps on T6 myself.

D) You are coming into a thread that was created in asking about a BIS, claiming that a BIS doesn't matter. Says it all.

The thread asked what we put on our Novus. I responded to that and gave my reasoning for it. YOU are the one who is claiming I said BiS doesn't matter. What I have said is that theoretical models are only good on paper and that in real world applications they tend to rarely be met.

E) If you are going for an economical Novus build (which wasn't what this thread was for), there are BETTER options. Hell, put crit instead of piety, at least its a dps increase over piety. Piety doesn't give you a DPS increase in any meaningful fight (as AOE isn't required in current high end game).

Again with the "meaningful fight" crap... Tell me, how many people in the entire game's population do you think have actually ever cleared even T6? I'll bet you'll guess way too high. ANY fight in this game is meaningful, and while things like AoE damage might not be perfect for Coil, you'll be pissed if you're trying to run a Dungeon without it. You're so fixated on a SCoB, EX Primals, BiS, overmelded, overgeared, expensive build that you're blind to the value of anything else and berate anyone who goes a different route for what in the end is an insanely small difference in DPS.

So go ahead and spout your drivel of "Optimal or GO HOME". It's great you're pushing for that extra 0.8dps over others... if that's what you want to do, go right at it. Not that it will truely matter in any fight in the game, as if 0.8dps is what you needed to win your group has other problems. Others (like myself) have different build priorities and when are asked what we did, have every right to give our response without you attempting to rake us over the coals for them. Especially when you misrepresent what we state on purpose.

[HaroldSaxon]

So go ahead and spout your drivel of "Optimal or GO HOME". It's great you're pushing for that extra 0.8dps over others... if that's what you want to do, go right at it. Not that it will truely matter in any fight in the game, as if 0.8dps is what you needed to win your group has other problems. Others (like myself) have different build priorities and when are asked what we did, have every right to give our response without you attempting to rake us over the coals for them. Especially when you misrepresent what we state on purpose.

You forgot to bold where the OP asked for BIS. He specifically said "For Black Mage Novus, should I go all out Det + Crits or Det + Spell Speed for BiS?". That is in your quote. Piety is not in the BIS for BLM, and there isn't any evidence whatsoever to it being a DPS increase for current raiding content (2nd coil, Ex-Primals). It has as much use for a BLM as skillspeed or dexterity or parry.

Having different build priorities is fine, its your choice, but it has been mathematically proven what the BIS is, and a BIS is about getting as much DPS as possible. You don't go into a discussion about BIS saying its only a 0.8 DPS loss when your idea is shown to be incorrect.

If you was to say its an option instead of expensive materia, as I said earlier in the thread, then that would be valid. Personally, i'd rather put accuracy or crit on instead if I was going for a cheap option, however, given that the Novus is to be further iterated on in 2.38 and beyond, investing in the best possible stats could be a wise investment.

[HaroldSaxon]

The "hard facts" that were "calculated" do not take into account many factors that come into play in real world situations.

While the stat weights *may* be correct for a perfect rotation on a stationary object, they won't be the same for each encounter.

I'm also using an i110 weapon (UAT) and for coil also have 1 bard with Foes at the start.

T6 - I've done 420, but average about 410.
T7 - Like you say, it's useless for comparison, due to forced dps stops.
T8 - I've done 444, but average around 435-440
T9 - Last kill I was on 381, but did have paralyse at 1 point during the final phase, as someone messed up a thunder xD

So the dps is pretty similar, yet I'm using what is in your opinion a poorer rotation, poorer build and weaker accessories. (I do agree the crafted gears can be nice with crazy melds, but imo not worth the gil over i110)

I know, I tried to say hello and welcome you to Odin, but my PM seemed to be ignored xD

I must have missed it when you originally sent it but caught you last night! I have /tells on a different tab with no noise due to gil spammers. On faerie at least, materia was a lot cheaper over there when I did it, but if you meld in the right order, it isn't too expensive.

I honestly think a better player than me would do more with my gearset. I still don't feel that i'm anywhere near the best BLM I can be, and its what keeps me going in the game. I've not spent as much time as I've wanted in T8/9 because I had raid group issues and was away, but I expect that to change now with my new group. If I can get the chestpiece and legs, I can see myself breaking 450 in T8, T9 its hard to say because of all the breaks, and again, i've been in there once (properly, did some messing around on Phase 1 when I first unlocked it).

Don't get me wrong, the i110 stuff is nice, but unfortunately most of them are either main stat crit or main stat det, which given that those are weighted the bottom two, its annoying. It limits people that want to run spellspeed to running crafted pieces; i'd certainly be using a lot of the ST set if it was upgradable to i110 (which is a massive error on their part imo).

[scarebearz]

I must have missed it when you originally sent it but caught you last night! I have /tells on a different tab with no noise due to gil spammers. On faerie at least, materia was a lot cheaper over there when I did it, but if you meld in the right order, it isn't too expensive.

Explains that xD Seemed odd as you were still moving around as I pm'd

The gil seller spam (on Odin at least), is nowhere near as bad as it used to be.

Materia prices on Odin... O.o lol, I could afford it, but just not a justifiable gain in my opinion.

@Numenor - To be fair Harold comes across much harsher on the forums than he actually does in game ;D Seems a decent guy to me and does sound like he knows how to play BLM to a decent level.

Don't get me wrong, the i110 stuff is nice, but unfortunately most of them are either main stat crit or main stat det, which given that those are weighted the bottom two, its annoying. It limits people that want to run spellspeed to running crafted pieces; i'd certainly be using a lot of the ST set if it was upgradable to i110 (which is a massive error on their part imo).

My main argument is that different builds suit different types of player and different encounters better than others, regardless of what puro's maths says should be the best dps under perfect conditions.

I don't really think the 3 offstats differ enough to worry about it too much tbh. xD

[Infamous]

How would you guys allocate stats if you already have 29 points in crit?

[Numenor1379]

How would you guys allocate stats if you already have 29 points in crit?

+44 SSPD, +31 CRIT

[Serephine]

I feel like this whole thread is two people arguing lol.

I personally am doing Crit and det. It's very expensive but I think it suits me I am considering some SS, but hopefully my gil bank holds out.

GIL sellers, here I come

[HaroldSaxon]

I feel like this whole thread is two people arguing lol.

Well, as far as i'm concerned, there isn't really an argument. If you want the best DPS, go Spellspeed/Det. If you want crit and not as much dps, go spellspeed/crit, crit/spellspeed or crit/det. If you want to prepare for 2.4 raiding, go spellspeed/acc.

Or if you are silly, put piety on.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...ive_web#gid=50