[Pole] Do you want to see the summoner class reworked?

[MercuryD]

in fact in the story we see someone who has (though they are evil (maybe by mind influence), probably because most of the primals are evil or not interested in being pets).

Can you give an example of when this happened? Because I can only think of Belias-Egi, which is a color swap of Ifrit-Egi, no real change there.

[Dwill]

Can you give an example of when this happened? Because I can only think of Belias-Egi, which is a color swap of Ifrit-Egi, no real change there.

It's funny because Tristan doesn't get to use a greater amount of essence, he's just using the essence of an Elder Primal, which is Belias in this case and Belias is totally different than Ifrit in term of look, even if Tristan only gets a recolored Ifrit-Egi.

[Shougun]

Yes there is something that explains it in the lore. A Primal's power level is in direct correlation with the amount of Aether amassed, more often than not via a huge amount of crystals. For our egi, it works the same. We summon them by using the essence we gained by fighting the primal as a catalyst then give they become an Aetherical Manifestation of what the primal looks in our mind, which means that they are a concentrated amount of Aether. For them to be stronger/bigger, a bigger amount of Aether would be needed which means exposure to a high amount of Aether which is a big no no due to serious side effects which includes aether sickness (poisoning).



That's already what we do. Fighting the primals imbues us with their essence, to which we transmute into the Egis.

Can you give an example of when this happened? Because I can only think of Belias-Egi, which is a color swap of Ifrit-Egi, no real change there.

It's funny because Tristan doesn't get to use a greater amount of essence, he's just using the essence of an Elder Primal, which is Belias in this case and Belias is totally different than Ifrit in term of look, even if Tristan only gets a recolored Ifrit-Egi.

Poisoning ones self for strength isn't an unheard of FF aspect (including unintentional poisonings we have quite a few characters lol).

Anyway if your point is to use lore to say we can't have it but then lore shows ways we can, then... obviously we can we just need to use these methods. Aether poising, finding rare allagan catalyst machines, ect ect. Lore does not prohibit change, and it doesn't limit them to a particular look (as Dwill has educated us, part of the process is our mind).

I was indeed referencing Belias-egi, who was a color change /and/ size change. I doubt we will be making pacts with Ascians anytime soon, but it shows change is possible in game (rather than just speculating on the info we have).

At this exact moment I'd have to agree with people using lore that we can't have a change right at this second (doesn't make sense in respect to lore); however, if people using lore as a end all be all... then obviously it isn't true. As change -can- make sense lore wise given quests to explain it (amassing massive amounts of crystals to poison ones self, special quest events, or technologies). If the comment is "I don't want to poison myself" then hey I respect opinions, but we are not factually limited to a certain look/size or ability set.

I don't know about other people asking for changes to SMN but in my mind this would be something introduced at the expansion, allowing new levels, story, and changes to take place that make sense.

Lore isn't summoner's limitation given time, the power given and aspect it appears in, and shouldn't be used as one.

[MercuryD]

Lore IS the end-all-be-all in game, if the lore doesn't agree with it then it will not be. That being said, lore can evolve. I am sure we will never see a full primal as a summon but a size increase could be a possibility sometime in the far future. Tristan summoned Belias-egi by using not only crystals, but job stones (which I would assume would have more influence being that just 1 allows us to summon). I don't really see us doing more than what the Allagans did, seeing as they invented the art and we are practicing a small portion of it.

tldr; Lore makes all the rules. Possibilities abound.

[Shougun]

Lore IS the end-all-be-all in game, if the lore doesn't agree with it then it will not be. That being said, lore can evolve. I am sure we will never see a full primal as a summon but a size increase could be a possibility sometime in the far future. Tristan summoned Belias-egi by using not only crystals, but job stones (which I would assume would have more influence being that just 1 allows us to summon). I don't really see us doing more than what the Allagans did, seeing as they invented the art and we are practicing a small portion of it.

tldr; Lore makes all the rules. Possibilities abound.

Yes I meant to say that people saying the current lore means we can't ever have a change, that wouldn't be true because the lore has allowed it. But I can see how I said it made it very unclear XD

Yeah I doubt we will get full primals as personal pets because they're just so big (and would require a lot of aether...)... But if we ever get personal limit breaks it would be neat if we could have the tier 3 (or 4 if that would exist) limit break be the primal's in the fights (last tier of course).

[Dwill]

Yes I meant to say that people saying the current lore means we can't ever have a change, that wouldn't be true because the lore has allowed it. But I can see how how I said it made it very unclear XD

Yeah I doubt we will get full primals as personal pets because they're just so big... But if we ever get personal limit breaks it would be neat if we could have the tier 3 (or 4 if that would exist) limit break be the primal's in the fights (last tier of course).

Lore can indeed change over the time but summoning anything greater than Egis would need a retcon which is really frown upon, though entirely within their rights.

And if my memory serves me right, job specific LB are supposed to be coming at some point in the future and the speculation is that if a Summoners uses it, it would be based of the currently used Egi's Primal form (all of this being speculation).

[Shougun]

Lore can indeed change over the time but summoning anything greater than Egis would need a retcon which is really frown upon, though entirely within their rights.

And if my memory serves me right, job specific LB are supposed to be coming at some point in the future and the speculation is that if a Summoners uses it, it would be based of the currently used Egi's Primal form (all of this being speculation).

I don't think we will ever go above "essence" (egi) status either, but we can definitely change the shapes and sizes of egi's without retcon (so long as they don't overpower the originals, and we can explain the extra aether required).

Also talking about aether poisoning was the aether teleporting poison retconed? I remember in 1.0 we had a limit because of poisoning, but I don't remember how Yoshida removed that bit.. was it Atomos?

[Dwill]

I don't think we will ever go above "essence" (egi) status either, but we can definitely change the shapes and sizes of egi's without retcon (so long as they don't overpower the originals, and we can explain the extra aether required).

That would be feasible to a degree but highly unlikely since Square Enix already stated they weren't going to change the Egis' appearance, back when it was a much bigger deal than it currently is.

Also talking about aether poisoning was the aether teleporting poison retconed? I remember in 1.0 we had a limit because of poisoning, but I don't remember how Yoshida removed that bit.. was it Atomos?

It is indeed because of Atomos.

[Akiza]

The Summoner needs to focus on Summoning and Pet aspects instead of Dot management since most of the Summoner's power is used in Summoning.

Making a Hyur sized Primals is a reasonable request.

[Jediman]

Atlest make the egi look more realistic guess this is what they got for the next gen console more graphic details to it please.