In regard to the Scholars

[Impure]

Waaw you guys need to relax lmfao.

You know and I know that SCH in PvP is insane! They have the survivability of a tank and the damage of a DPS, you can't have the best of both worlds and say "WOW SQUEENIX MESSIN UP MUH CLASS". I occasionally do SCH in frontlines because it's easy as sht to run around, keeping myself and everyone around me alive while throwing out DoTs and hitting bane. It's literally amazing how easily a SCH can kite five people around and still remain at 80%-100% HP. Anyway if your class gets nerfed than oh well! Find a new strat and make that work!

[Gor]

snip

Byooki you're my homie and everything but I disagree. Healers can survive in Frontlines in general not because we are an "insane" class, but because scrub noob tanks and melee don't know how to play pvp. I've been able to kite 5 or more people not because of anything special i am doing, i'm just casting Adloquium every few steps, but because noob players overwrite each others stuns, Full Swings, silences, and every other CC under the sun, thus diminishing returning all their cc's out (with the exception of heavy which stays up seemingly infinitely). i can count the times i've had two tanks on me, and both of them put their full swings on me at the same time, and i just purify it off and keep it moving like they aren't even there. then Super Goon comes flying through the air like a speeding bullet to stun me not once, but twice, thus also nullifying stuns. and other times i just juke them to use whatever cc's they may have just so i can get my Equanimity off. there is nothing op about SCH healing, we don't even heal for that much, nor does Eos. so to say that its 100% the class is the reason why we have high survivibility is giving SCHs too much credit. as someone said earlier, it gives the "illusion" that SCHs are indestructible when in reality there are other factors going into it, that nay-sayers are neglecting to recognize, that has nothing to do with what the SCH is doing, and everything to do with fail enemy players just raking their faces across the keyboard, hitting random buttons and expecting something good to happen.

[Impure]

snap

I totally get what you're saying, SCH antics aren't as strong as what is being seen, but the thing is to the new (PvP) player it's one of those walls that they cannot climb over. I've been doing pvp since the SCH/SMN nerfs (which were totally justified IMO) I know how to deal with SCHs/WHMs as a melee, newer players, however, don't have a clue what to do against SCHs/WHMs which make teams stacking healers just even more stronger than intended. One SCH with six lustrates was enough but four-five of them? It makes it nearly impossible to make a dent into someone. I feel that solo SCH/WHM isn't a big deal but there has to be something done about stacking healers.

[Gor]

I don't know if anything can be done about it really. its not like SE can put up a barrier that says "you have reached your healer limit for this flag, please go away" and turns away any other healers that are approaching the base. I play battlegrounds in WoW and it's the same thing with flags stacked with 4+ healers deep with shamans, priests, paladins, monks and druids healing everywhere and nothing brings them down because all their heals complement each other. monk heals are so powerful in that game that i've seen a single monk heal keep up an entire team at one flag and no one could kill neither his team or the monk. the only thing that eventually takes them down is just bringing a death squad of all the team's dps and focusing them down one at a time or players just ignore the base and go take something else. and for a long time in WoW there was no diminishing returns in PvP although I don't believe that is the case anymore.

so just based on that i know people are frustrated but stacked healers really isn't a problem. its just that teams do it wrong by constantly smashing their faces into the same wall of 4+ healers the entire game just because their team is assigned to it, thus wasting time and before they know it the game is nearly over and they STILL haven't taken that base. i mean just because an alliance is in group A, doesn't mean players should just keep running back to Manor feeding kills but I see players doing it when they can go take enemy Outposts or Markets. players just need to not be so programmed in doing the same tactics over and over again and get used to going to another base if there are too many at one, because if there are 4+ healers at that base, then they have other bases that is short 4 healers. i tell my team if we can't take it the first attempt, don't run back and just go take something else and come back to it later. those same healers won't be there forever.

[Skeet]

Waaw you guys need to relax lmfao.

You know and I know that SCH in PvP is insane! They have the survivability of a tank and the damage of a DPS, you can't have the best of both worlds and say "WOW SQUEENIX MESSIN UP MUH CLASS". It's literally amazing how easily a SCH can kite five people around and still remain at 80%-100% HP.

I never have a problem killing SCH's. I jump for joy whenever I see that the healer is a SCH vs a WHM all the time.

[Nova_Dresden]

Generally speaking, changes to PVP cannot go without also affecting PVE

If I remember correctly all the abilities in the game are either PvP or PvE only, or they have 2 separate damage calculations to prevent one affecting the other.

[Zyrusticae]

If a SCH could "handle" another DPS, why would anyone play anything other than SCH ? SCH should be with their party and nowhere else.

Exactly my thoughts, and why I find posts like

A healer that can't Sprint to get away and a healer that can't DPS to defend himself is a dead healer. I've played WoW long enough to know how miserable it is to be a healer and have no Sprint to get away and no DPS to defend myself. But if SE does do that then by logic they must increase the absorption of Galvanized to make up for the increase damage we will be taking.

utterly laughable. Guess who's supposed to defend you? YOUR TEAM. You are not meant to be self-sufficient, and you are most definitely not meant to be a one-man island. It's a team game, and the game has to be balanced for team encounters and all possible group compositions.

A jack-of-all-trades that does everything well is by definition an anomaly that needs to be crushed. It cannot exist in a balanced PvP design, period. Healers should be dependent on their team members to keep them alive and deal damage, just in the same way the DPS is dependent on the healers to keep them up for longer than a few seconds of focused fire and to remove DoTs and debuffs. This interdependency is at the core of the game's design, and the idea that there should exist classes that exist entirely independently of other classes is hilariously short-sighted.

[Gor]

A jack-of-all-trades that does everything well is by definition an anomaly that needs to be crushed. It cannot exist in a balanced PvP design, period. Healers should be dependent on their team members to keep them alive and deal damage, just in the same way the DPS is dependent on the healers to keep them up for longer than a few seconds of focused fire and to remove DoTs and debuffs. This interdependency is at the core of the game's design, and the idea that there should exist classes that exist entirely independently of other classes is hilariously short-sighted.

only SCHs arent a jack of all trades. if there is pressure on them, guess what, they can't dps. they have to heal. and if there is no pressure on them, then you should be allowed to attack. its not like we are doing the dps of a blm or smn. healers dependent on the team? doubt it. i don't know what games you've been playing, but even the top mmo's pvp environment aren't designed that way. in WoW, prior to them giving healers more damage to their damage abilities, healers couldn't kill anybody, but were immortal. but now yea go ahead and try to 1v1 a Disc priest in PvP, not only is it still immortal but you will also die trying to take it out. so that just goes to show that your interdependency is not the core of a game's design and WoW is one of the if not the top mmo in the world.

[Zyrusticae]

only SCHs arent a jack of all trades.

Please stop. Just... just stop. You can't deny reality any more than you can change the direction the Earth spins around the sun.

[RavenGrey]

only SCHs arent a jack of all trades.

Support a party? Check. Need to DPS cause party is fine? Check. Need to tank cause a bunch of people are on you? Check. And perform each role quite well at that (if not arguably better than other jobs whose only allocation is one of those roles).

I'm not even saying I'm for or against a SCH nerf, but seriously, if that's not jack of all trades, what exactly is?