Delay the Rogue/Ninja class till expansion.

[DoctorPepper]

First i have already found like minded individuals in this thread. A clear minority, which i knew before even hiting post it would be small, in fact, i thought i was going to be alone here.
Second, is a petition to? the community? im asking the forums posters to delay the NIN introduction till another tank and healers are ready to get into the game?

Not my style to answer this kind of off-topics post, but thats ok for this time i guess.

I'm not sure what you were trying to say in the second part there, I edited my original message while you were posting I guess to add "to achieve some goal" which is the real point I was trying to get across.

The only way that a petition will achieve its goal is by convincing people that it is the best thing to do for the majority so if you already knew you're the minority, and don't care about convincing other people about your cause, then I really don't see the point of this thread at all. Perhaps you just named it incorrectly or something and just wanted the chance to see if you had a clever idea with no intention of achieving your goal.

As for it not being your style, it's really in your best interest since I'm bumping your thread and I am not insulting you. I'm trying to understand why you call this a petition, yet don't seem to care what other people think if it doesn't align with your own thoughts. Doesn't seem so off topic to me.

[Sparky]

Because of this thread, I'm going to roll a Ninja a the first opportunity. I would like to think that many would do the same too.

[Themis]

I remember when Arcanist was announced, and playable. People said that everyone would just be an Arcanist. It lasted a few weeks, then people decided they'd actually rather play other classes.

Yes, everyone will play the same things when it arrives. It won't last, though. And it doesn't matter when they are added; it'll be the same thing then anyway.

[Wildsprite]

Because of this thread, I'm going to roll a Ninja a the first opportunity. I would like to think that many would do the same too.

maybe I'm weird but I really liked the loo of the daggers for Rogue ^-^

[Velox]

I will not be rolling a Rogue when the patch hits and will continue to play healer. You guys can thank me later when we are running double rogue low-level dungeons, I'll probably end up seeing most of you there since I'm not going to be in the majority :P.

[ZReport]

Thats the case in most MMOs, that you could say is the industry`s way to deal with things.
Gamers and communities have become used to get half coocked, bad preseted, bad implemented not filling content. As if ATMA threads were not enough, we all have just got over it. Is a peculiar way to see how things works. Gamer`s standars have come so low that anything a devolper does is at best: "not bad enough i can keep playing".

There is a reason why this industry is dying, and there is a reason why SE has not being doing well these few years. Lazy development efforts, an indulgent community. FFXIV:ARR has been a really good experience, do not missunderstand, but as times goes by, quality of content has been going down, since devolopers have noticed, that the love for the game makes everything tolerable. Like ATMAs, like PvP, like sightseeing log.

What is your vision of well presented content, then? I always here this argument that the industry is dying, yet I still see data that presents top MMOs still in the millions of subscribers (albeit a couple of millions or thousands of subs lost to MOBA style games), despite more and more MMOs being added into the mix. The fact is, people like grinds, people like doing the daily work for a shiny weapon at the end of the road. They also like going into the next grind, and/or using their newly obtained weapon to fight monsters to get a newer, more shiny weapon.

FFXIV did not create a new standard, it simply follows standards that are known to work successfully, and created it's own success from it. SE is doing well now, thanks to FFXI still bringing in the numbers from dedicated subbers, and now the newly acclaimed FFXIV: ARR. And delvelopment efforts have been anything but "lazy." Laziness cannot take a very dead and failing MMO, reimage and re-release it, and come out sucessful without some serious work put in. There's a reason why people say FFXIV: ARR set an unheard of precedent with it's sucesss -- it is literally the only MMO that has recovered from it's own initial failings, something unheard of in the MMO community.

The indulgent community however, I will agree with you on.

[Alexander_Dragonfang]

The only way that a petition will achieve its goal is by convincing people that it is the best thing to do for the majority

I'm trying to understand why you call this a petition, yet don't seem to care what other people think if it doesn't align with your own thoughts. Doesn't seem so off topic to me.

False. Democracy and popularity are not the only way to make things happen.

I care about what people think even if doesn`t aling with my thoughts, what i dont care about are the "no /10chars" and jokes about the thread. And belive me, i just read through them. I have been constantly ansewing opossing opinions to mine in the thread, specially those well formulated ones about how the DF ratio has nothing to do with how many players play what roles ratio. Which i have even accepted as it was true, because is reasonable. And thats what i consider and care, reasonable, well presented, arguments.

What is your vision of well presented content, then? I always here this argument that the industry is dying, yet I still see data that presents top MMOs still in the millions of subscribers (albeit a couple of millions or thousands of subs lost to MOBA style games), despite more and more MMOs being added into the mix. The fact is, people like grinds, people like doing the daily work for a shiny weapon at the end of the road. They also like going into the next grind, and/or using their newly obtained weapon to fight monsters to get a newer, more shiny weapon.

FFXIV did not create a new standard, it simply follows standards that are known to work successfully, and created it's own success from it. SE is doing well now, thanks to FFXI still bringing in the numbers from dedicated subbers, and now the newly acclaimed FFXIV: ARR. And delvelopment efforts have been anything but "lazy." Laziness cannot take a very dead and failing MMO, reimage and re-release it, and come out sucessful without some serious work put in. There's a reason why people say FFXIV: ARR set an unheard of precedent with it's sucesss -- it is literally the only MMO that has recovered from it's own initial failings, something unheard of in the MMO community.

The indulgent community however, I will agree with you on.

FFXIV:ARR devolpment wasnt lazy, because they were literlly wallet forced to create something worth, cause SE couldnt afford another "Final Fantasy Spirit Within" hit with FFXIV. And i agree, the level of polish, the well done rebuild, and the overall experience and delivery of FFXIV:ARR was outsanding and top level. SE has recovered, not fully but numbers are looking good in comparison to what they look 2 years ago. Player base has stablished, the community has been solified, and the balance between trolls, haters, white knights and critical poster has become into balance aligned with the stars of the interwebz.

NOW. Thing have become "normal". Devolpers have began to soften their hand on about how things are delivered and the overall polish of content has been seeing small but clear drops. We are beyond that point already where everyone on the internet was calling "6 months for F2P" we have stablished a foothold already, a very good one, thing that TESO and Wildstar for example havent and they are struggling. Nope, we are better than that because of things like presentation, polish, well devoloped content and delivery of said content.

My vision of well presented content? What 2.0 was. Even what 2.1 was... But 2.2 already had their flaws because of lazy devoloping, 2.28 had it. I hope 2.3 straightens the path once more. Im just worried the indulgency of the community reaches the developer team now we are past "the critical age" of any P2P MMORPG.
And this is off-topic because is a discussion about me and my objective, which is not the topic, and from now on, im off from this off-topic xD.

I remember when Arcanist was announced, and playable. People said that everyone would just be an Arcanist. It lasted a few weeks, then people decided they'd actually rather play other classes.

Yes, everyone will play the same things when it arrives. It won't last, though. And it doesn't matter when they are added; it'll be the same thing then anyway.

Thing is, ACN was launched along another 7 classes. Yes a lot of people went to rush it (and actually was pretty bad) since it was new from the beta perspective. Now, there is nothing new besides the NIN. What happend with ACN will be nothing compared to whats going to happen here if NIN comes alone.

[Keres]

Thing is, ACN was launched along another 7 classes.

Legacy servers, dude. Lots of people already had everything else at 50. It's not that different than the situation we're in now with Rogue.

[Sparky]

Legacy servers, dude. Lots of people already had everything else at 50. It's not that different than the situation we're in now with Rogue.

Indeed, and in fact with the passage of time lots of people on non-legacy servers are already in the same boat or near. As you said, it's not that different at all.

[AeirTalies]

I say release it. I could use less monks to compete with.