When to use Flare?

[Kletian]

I'm hoping there's some sarcasm here. Surely it doesn't make sense to use Flares and the rely on Transpose tricks instead of just using lots of Astral 3 Fire 2s until low mana.

[NoctisUmbra]

Unless the gear/weapon difference is far too much, there's really no excuse for the tank to lose hate. Flash/Overpower spam isn't exactly rocket science. There's also Quelling Strikes.

That said, if the only reasonable use for a skill is as a way to intentionally reduce your dps output, then I think it's implied that skill is pretty much useless.

[NyneAlexander]

Also worth noting that if you screw up a double flare rotation, you are sitting and twiddling your thumbs at 0 mp for almost 2 GCD until your transpose becomes available again

[NoctisUmbra]

Yup! Good thing it's really easy to do once you get a feel for it as the window is exceptionally forgiving. A few minutes at the training dummies and anyone can get it down.

[Maero]

After Your fire 2's and up until your very low on mp (after a while you will know the timing) then cast flare> convert>either swiftcast flare or just flare> Mega Ether> Flare
There you have 3 Flares
You can do more then 3 flares with transpose but using flares after you transpose is a very big loss of dps, same goes for instance if you would flare under umbral Ice
Triple flares i have been using in coil and all the new HM dungeons, and if you have 2 blm's around well yes

[NoctisUmbra]

Fire 2s? What Fire 2s?

[NoctisUmbra]

Apologies for the double post, but I was casually browsing on my mobile for my earlier posts and I have to admit I only just skimmed through and didn't even bother to quote :/

After Your fire 2's and up until your very low on mp (after a while you will know the timing) then cast flare> convert>either swiftcast flare or just flare> Mega Ether> Flare
There you have 3 Flares
You can do more then 3 flares with transpose but using flares after you transpose is a very big loss of dps, same goes for instance if you would flare under umbral Ice
Triple flares i have been using in coil and all the new HM dungeons, and if you have 2 blm's around well yes

The bit about not using Flares after Transpose isn't entirely good advice. That, coupled with the mention of Fire II, suggests to me that you aren't familiar with the superior AoE rotation that is the double flare rotation, Maero. Said rotation involves doing exactly what you're suggesting not to do, after all

When approaching a fresh AoE pack, you do the following traditionally:

Fire III > Flare > Convert > Swiftcast > Flare > Transpose > WAIT* > Flare > Flare > Transpose > WAIT* > Flare > Flare > etc...

Obviously the opener can be extended with an Ether.

Now, the WAIT is the critical section of this rotation. The idea is, you want to time your cast so that you get a fresh tick of MP in your Umbral Ice state just as your first Flare goes through. This puts you into Astral Fire III and also leaves you with enough MP to cast the 2nd Flare.

The basic guideline for how long you wait is after you Transpose, you wait until you see your first tick of MP. As soon as you see it, you count 2 seconds in your head. You have to begin casting your Flare just before you would say 2, that is just shy of 2 seconds after your first tick of MP. The window of error is actually quite forgiving, but if you stick with that rule of thumb you should get it. Some practice at the training dummies is a good way to establish the muscle memory.


It's counter-intuitive that the best rotation is one that involves waiting, but unfortunately that's the case here due both to the fact that Fire II is much too far below Flare in potency, and that this rotation involves casting Flare, and only Flare, after the opener and no time wasted on a single target spell.

[StubHub]

Yup! Good thing it's really easy to do once you get a feel for it as the window is exceptionally forgiving. A few minutes at the training dummies and anyone can get it down.

I've seen comments like the one in bold said numerous times. Along with other things like people counting the 2 seconds in their head. Are people guessing or using an internal clock? Are people unaware that you can just use the umbral ice buff timer to see your 2 second wait time? i.e. You get your tick at 8 seconds on your UI buff, you would start your cast at 6 seconds on your UI buff.

Just throwing it out there because i've seen enough people say things that lead me to believe they are kind of guessing at the 2 second window when the game gives you its own timer to use.

[NoctisUmbra]

I've seen comments like the one in bold said numerous times. Along with other things like people counting the 2 seconds in their head. Are people guessing or using an internal clock? Are people unaware that you can just use the umbral ice buff timer to see your 2 second wait time? i.e. You get your tick at 8 seconds on your UI buff, you would start your cast at 6 seconds on your UI buff.

Just throwing it out there because i've seen enough people say things that lead me to believe they are kind of guessing at the 2 second window when the game gives you its own timer to use.

Personally I've just developed a feel for it. Even if I'm moving about, I know when to start casting.

The Umbral Ice buff tip is a good one. Ultimately, use whatever works for you.

[IceSpear]

OK thank for your help guys I think I'm starting to get it, just need to work on the beginning bit.