How to make more players succeed in coil.

[Ooshima]

Lol, since you guys are all worried about and 8 alts abuse with loot then may i purpose this instead? How about Coil simulations? It doesn't drop loot at all and it's soul purpose is to teach players how to play the content. You'll be able to run it multiple times, that way people can dish out all of their trial and error through the simulations before tackling the real raid.

In addition this will allow FC's a way to teach members how to beat coil without the penalty of being locked out of the raid for the week.

If any FC leaders are really up to it, they could plan their T6-T9 clears on Sunday/Monday and then the rest of the week, bring in members and play with them WITHOUT clearing it - such as intentionally wiping at 5% or so. SE doesn't need to create a simulation thing for it.

[LalaRu]

As things are, it is fine. If OP's group wants help new members, they have to put them in their static and teach 'em, and their FC needs work hard to make another static so all of them have fun on cleaning turns. I guess OP asking changes because none of their static members wants leave room for the other FC member get in.

[Geobryn]

Loot lockout (CT system, assuming you can clear T9 as well):
- Each member gets 1 guaranteed loot per turn, per week. This equates to 32 pieces of guaranteed gear per week. Not counting the 2 Sands, 2 Oils, and the Unidentified Allagan Tomestone (to be honest, I don't even know how a lockout would apply for the Sand/Oil/UAT).
- There is zero chance of redundant gear.
- After 4 weeks, your group gets a total of 128 pieces of gear. Each person gets 16 pieces of gear after 4 weeks - enough to fully gear a class.

If we go down the CT route now, what's left after 4 weeks?

you know ... coil could be counted as 1 dungeon, meaning, it just 8 drops per week for raid grp/1 loot per person, oils/sands/tome could be counted into that lock out too
if you take it like that, its even less drops then the current lock out system and you would have to run it multiple times anyway if you would want to "choose" the drop you want, depending on the RNG gods

8 players go into coil turn, gets 2 drops plus sand/oil/tome and gets distributed. They get out, one member leaves, a new player joins.

They clear the turn again and 2 drops plus sand/oil/tome drops again. 7 old members can't roll on it, the new player gets only one item of the 3

How does this sound exploitable?

fixed it for you :P

[juniglee]

you know ... coil could be counted as 1 dungeon, meaning, it just 8 drops per week for raid grp/1 loot per person, oils/sands/tome could be counted into that lock out too
if you take it like that, its even less drops then the current lock out system and you would have to run it multiple times anyway if you would want to "choose" the drop you want, depending on the RNG gods

There'd be no reason to run the other turns then.

You just want weapon? Do T9 and be done with it. Tank pants? Just do T7.

Everyone is going to want different parts, and frankly this sort of system would better suit DF or PF, than to have a static for.

[Geobryn]

There'd be no reason to run the other turns then.

You just want weapon? Do T9 and be done with it. Tank pants? Just do T7.

Everyone is going to want different parts, and frankly this sort of system would better suit DF or PF, than to have a static for.

two questions...
can you solo t6-t9 ?
would you say, to a guildie, "**** off i dont need to run t6 with you" ?

[Gardes]

That will be a pure logistical nightmare. As people progress, they will want to aim for specific turns for specific loot from a specific class they haven't finished gearing and certain people would want to do other turns. People will be split. You can just blow this off with 'good FC will help each other out' but you'll ONLY have one week to complete everyone's loot allotment. You'll have to spam a turn until 1 player gets the gear he wants before catering to other players that wants to do other turns and you'll see loot dropped to the floor because other people doesn't want to waste their loot allotment for the week and as weeks go on it'll just keep getting harsher. People will expect others to keep helping them until they get that loot, they will have to spam the same turns over and over. People will get tired and maybe start pressuring others to just take what they get and be done for the week and they will start hating each other for it. FC relations will just go downhill from there. Dramas/bails/in-fighting WILL ensue.

No amount of internet friendship will hold up on that amount of pressure to finish multiple amounts of turns to get 8 people 1 loot each, let alone extra people in the FC. Within a week. Each week. If anything, the pressure to do perfectly each attempt will be even greater and people will start pointing fingers at less than stellar performance and be even happier to get them kicked out of coil runs if it means less runs each week as long they have enough people to run in.

Look, I get that people want to do coil badly because I do too but let's not spout off ideas without thinking about the repercussions and campaign hard for it straight away.

[ToffeeCoffee]

If you are taken through by 7 other experienced people you learn nothing, unless they purposefully wipe when you do. It's called a carry.

Anyway it's a broken record at this point, they have made it clear that coil's lockout system will never change yet people keep on playing groundhog day on the forums. Just give up and accept it for what it is.

With all due respect, a lot of people cannot beat Coil 2 easily and farm it like your FC can (for various reasons) and not everyone wants to join your FC to cash in on the benefits provided (easy clear/win loot every week). Static groups who aren't as geared as your FC are hurting when only 1 or 2 players can't make it to the raid for whatever reason..and can't find a replacement in time before reset, meaning missed loot and longer time before geared enough to take on T9. Because of the lockout, suitable stand-in's when you need them are quite hard to find.

Having to pick up PUGs to replace static members that can't make it means you also lose the opportunity to pass tomestone/oil/sand to members of your static who need it and lose on greed rolls. Happened to us last week...sand went to someone who doesn't even have any High Allagan or the Weathered weapon to use it on.

[Geobryn]

snip

yeah, i kind of see what you mean, on the other end i throw out into a fray just part of the idea ...the thing is, i don't like lockouts/dailies/weeklies as a whole
but, there is one system in-game already which i consider to be the least evil, and that are leves
you can do them whenever you want and how many of them you want as long as you have them....
if i could apply this system to coil it would be like, at point of unlocking the coil you get 1 allowance to loot in coil and every week after as long as your sub is up you get another
and i would apply this to every lock out there is, like dailies and tome stones its like

but that is just me :P

[juniglee]

two questions...
can you solo t6-t9 ?
would you say, to a guildie, "**** off i dont need to run t6 with you" ?

Relevance of question?

[Shaone]

On way it could work is a selection option for "Practice Mode" on entry, with no loot (and maybe adjustable echo), and if anyone in the party has cleared then it is the only option. Combined with the upcoming confirmation dialog on entry, can make sure that everyone in the party is aware that they can't get any loot.

But it's OK as it is, just hard finding people who can play together at a certain time.

(<shameless mode> any patient EU tanks on Hyperion interested in a relaxed static see details at http://ffxiv.ariyala.com/ )