AOE Toggle Needs to GO

[Holland]

yeah, we know it's change for the sake of change. it is not change to make the game better.

You and I know the change of AoE button removal is not for the sake of changing, but actually to improve on it. You like saying that just to look cool. If you can show actual proof they are changing it just for the sake of it, go ahead (a screen shot of a PM from Yoshida confirming that to you or something of the sort).

Please do not say your assumptions as fact.

[darkstarpoet1]

You and I know the change of AoE button removal is not for the sake of changing, but actually to improve on it. You like saying that just to look cool. If you can show actual proof they are changing it just for the sake of it, go ahead (a screen shot of a PM from Yoshida confirming that to you or something of the sort).

Please do not say your assumptions as fact.

If you can show actual proof they are changing it to replace it with anything better, go ahead (a screen shot of a PM from Yoshida confirming that to you or something of the sort).

nowhere have they said they were adding anything. i believe if they said anything more than we will be removing it more people would be comfortable with the change. i'm one that would rather them say what they want to add before they take something away. i may support change with a known reason behind it, but not if i don't know what the change is.

that was the thing people are supporting it and hoping that something better will take its place, but we do not know that because zero information was given. if we got more info about what the change is then it could completely change the perception of the change.

[Ilean]

yeah, we know it's change for the sake of change. it is not change to make the game better.

Dumb assumption with nothing to back it up. I am willing to bet my lunch money that they are removing it either because there is a fundamental change in the new battle system on our ability to make almost any spell AoE, or if not that, simply because most of us hated the silly toggle that remembered last state and made us AoE offensive spells and single target cures.

Gogogogo shift+action bar spell = AoE!

[RabidSquirrel]

Gogogogo shift+action bar spell = AoE!

I'd be cool with that. Or use ctrl+action or alt+action. Keeping ctrl and alt to macros is duuuuumb. Or make a cancel spell key and double tap an action to AoE. Tap once more to revert back to single target cast.

[zzapp]

So is SE really removing the toggle? It's a done deal? Where was that stated?

Also, could someone educate me about toggling AoE with the Z key. My Z key does nothing?

Personally, I like the toggle. Beats having to deal with 2x the spells.

[darkstarpoet1]

So is SE really removing the toggle? It's a done deal? Where was that stated?

Also, could someone educate me about toggling AoE with the Z key. My Z key does nothing?

Personally, I like the toggle. Beats having to deal with 2x the spells.

yeah one of the mods confirmed it that they spoke with the developers and they said it was being taken away.

but yeah when casting a spell instead of clicking on the button to change aoe on/off the z key on your keyboard is the default key to toggle it and on a controller it is whatever key you have set to open your macro menu.

i understand they are taking it away, but i would love to hear what they plan to replace it with. at this point i am happy with it as it is, but maybe with some information on the change i could look forward to it.

[Ayerc]

Gogogogo shift+action bar spell = AoE!

Just an FYI, this is already used in game, as a way to stack Spells (and any WS for that matter) for Battle Regimens.

And how can a remembered state cause you to misfire an AoE spell...if it's on, it's on, if it's off, it's off... That's not the toggle's fault, that'd lie on the player who forgot what the spell they cast not a few seconds before was set on. And no, lag's not the problem there, that's entirely user-side.

In any event, if the change is being made to coincide with some other major change to the battle system, they need to tell us that along with the decision to remove the toggle. I don't think anyone can blame us for putting this move in the context of what we know about the game in it's current state, since we have nothing else to go on.

And I wouldn't say most players hate the toggle. If anything, they may hate the extra confirm, which others have pointed out is simply a sub-target confirmation, which would need to be there regardless. You can't select a target to cure if you're locked on the monster, and using the clunky targeting system as is to select a member to cure is way to slow and cumbersome for efficient casting.

[Kailea_Nagisa]

You're made up balance of the spells only shows that you got no clue about balancing stuff. Double the MP cost with 4/5 of its effectivity is already overpowering the Single version of the spell as soon as you have to heal more than 3 targets, making Single Version completely useless. If anything at all it should be 1.5x the MP cost with 30% of the effectivity of the single version. This is not the best balance there would be, but this is better balance for the spell than yours and I came up with it in 2 seconds...

oh please it was a rough example, I was not trying to be accurate, I did not even add "hate" numbers. Some of you are so desperate to come up with a decent argument about removing the toggle that you have to do this?

[Ilean]

Just an FYI, this is already used in game, as a way to stack Spells (and any WS for that matter) for Battle Regimens.

ok ctrl + spell!

And how can a remembered state cause you to misfire an AoE spell...if it's on, it's on, if it's off, it's off... That's not the toggle's fault, that'd lie on the player who forgot what the spell they cast not a few seconds before was set on. And no, lag's not the problem there, that's entirely user-side.

Well not all of us are perfect in mind and body, so a toggle that remembers it's last state is bad news once things heat up.

[TirionCrey]

oh please it was a rough example, I was not trying to be accurate, I did not even add "hate" numbers. Some of you are so desperate to come up with a decent argument about removing the toggle that you have to do this?

If it was a rough example, why do you add "Is it that hard SE?" when you obviously know yourself your example was nowhere near something SE could use. If you think it's so easy and it could be done in a matter of days writing some code, why do you not try to make a REAL accurate example and THEN say "Is it that hard SE" again?

Cause as soon as you would actually use your brain and think about balance and how it may effect other things, you would overheat your brain thinking about solutions for all the other stuff it will effect that need to be resolved so don't pull some smart ass BS like "Is it that hard" when you actually know yourself it IS hard, cause otherwise you would have come up with a better example.

And I don't need any argument for the toggle to go, the best has been stated and is pretty much the only reason why the people who want it to go, want it to go. Cause it will add more strategic thinking to the mage classes. And this is pretty much an undeniable fact. While the people who want the toggle to stay all come up with stupid arguments like "I don't want to deal with double the amount of spells" while fact is, they would never use all of them anyway, cause only the higher versions are gonna be of use for them, or do you run around with Cure/Sacrifice I still, even on R50? If you do, you got my pity...and if you're actually able to still put Cure/Sacrifice I on your action bars this even adds to the argument that toggle needs to go, cause you shouldn't be able to put up ALL of your spells w/o even thinking of what might be useful or not. It's all about decisions! Those decisions will make the classes unique and the players who play them as well, cause you will actually see differences between the players instead of just anyone spamming AoE.

I'm just sick of people thinking their solutions would fix everything in a matter of days, when they don't even really think about what they are talking and on top of that, come up with some silly arguments that are not even valid.

People screamed for "class uniqueness"...well it's as simple as that, if both, CON and THM are able to use any of their spells cross class AND use them as AoE and Single whenever they want, there goes your class uniqueness. Removing the toggle and limiting your amount of spells due to that plus making some spells class specific is exactly what people wanted, Class Uniqueness and there is almost no better way to implement it then that. AoE toggle just ruins it.