Plan to remove benefit for failing leves?

[syntaxlies]

I'm gonna keep my response a little shorter then yours so sorry if i leave out any juicy details. Failing the leves does not reward failure. It does the exact opposite. The reward is what you get at the end when you finish the leve gil, gear,items, faction credits. These are all thing that you do not get when you fail the leve. For every mob defeated we get sp(whether in a leve or not) so how are you considering the sp a reward. Its not like were running past the mobs and the sp lands on us as we run...

Fair enough, I'll speak with utmost veracity then.

As I stated to you before under more heated circumstances I "nothing you". Yes, it was meant to be cutting in part but it was also the truth summed up into a tight package. The truth is in the sense of I don't care what you or any other LS does on Fabul or any server. I don't say that in the sense of spite but rather I am a person who is very much a live and let live kind of guy as long as it doesn't effect me. I don't want to mess with people - it makes our server look petty and bad. So what you do with your LS doesn't bother me all that much. Why would it? We don't ever interact as far as I am aware. This is why, last time you and I argued I asked you, I asked you to show me where I had ever said a negative thing about you or Abbadon publicly. I hadn't because, as aforementioned, I don't care all that much.

In essence I can kind of speak for others (others being several other LSes on Fabul) that Abaddon isn't liked not because of anything other then you are seen as an arrogant (fill in what word you like). Not because of this bizarre blip in the system. Again, I am not taking a shot at you - I am in earnest telling you why. It has nothing or very little to do with the leve run failing system. Frankly, anyone can do it and many people had been doing it since IC stumbled upon it (which is who I was referencing last time). Theres nothing exclusive there in a good or bad way.

Generally speaking I don't like it because its very simple to me. It's rewarding failure and it shouldn't be there. People are going to do whats the fastest and most efficient. You can't blame a person for that. Hell, I have even started to try it after getting 3 battle jobs to 50 "the old fashion" way. Yet still, I want it gone. I simply do not like the idea of rewarding failure. Its a simplistic view for me (and a simplistic argument) and wish it gone. The game is too easy and getting to 50 is absurdly easy like this. I want challenge and a feel of accomplishment and unless they start changing things from how cozy it is now to something worth a damn the game will never truly pick up.

Thats my opinion in short.

[Molly_Millions]

Fair enough, I'll speak with utmost veracity then.

As I stated to you before under more heated circumstances I "nothing you". Yes, it was meant to be cutting in part but it was also the truth summed up into a tight package. The truth is in the sense of I don't care what you or any other LS does on Fabul or any server. I don't say that in the sense of spite but rather I am a person who is very much a live and let live kind of guy as long as it doesn't effect me. I don't want to mess with people - it makes our server look petty and bad. So what you do with your LS doesn't bother me all that much. Why would it? We don't ever interact as far as I am aware. This is why, last time you and I argued I asked you, I asked you to show me where I had ever said a negative thing about you or Abbadon publicly. I hadn't because, as aforementioned, I don't care all that much.

In essence I can kind of speak for others (others being several other LSes on Fabul) that Abaddon isn't liked not because of anything other then you are seen as an arrogant (fill in what word you like). Not because of this bizarre blip in the system. Again, I am not taking a shot at you - I am in earnest telling you why. It has nothing or very little to do with the leve run failing system. Frankly, anyone can do it and many people had been doing it since IC stumbled upon it (which is who I was referencing last time). Theres nothing exclusive there in a good or bad way.

Generally speaking I don't like it because its very simple to me. It's rewarding failure and it shouldn't be there. People are going to do whats the fastest and most efficient. You can't blame a person for that. Hell, I have even started to try it after getting 3 battle jobs to 50 "the old fashion" way. Yet still, I want it gone. I simply do not like the idea of rewarding failure. Its a simplistic view for me (and a simplistic argument) and wish it gone. The game is too easy and getting to 50 is absurdly easy like this. I want challenge and a feel of accomplishment and unless they start changing things from how cozy it is now to something worth a damn the game will never truly pick up.

Thats my opinion in short.

I wish we could send PMs here, but since we can't here goes. (Sorry to everyone else for derailing this thread)

Fair enough, in that case I apologize for calling you a douche in said conversation. As I tried to say in that convo, maybe those people see me as arrogant, but the truth is I' a down to earth guy and am extremely laid back, as anyone in Abaddon can attest to. I am however, a cynic. Don't confuse my cynicism as arrogance, it's only an attempt to get a laugh.

[Vackashken]

im gonna keep my response a little shorter then yours so sorry if i leave out any juicy details. Failing the leves does not reward failure.

It does. No amount of semantics or technicalities changes that. The reward is you get the same best SP giving leves in a row guaranteed. The gil is meaningless because you don't fail every single leve. You make plenty off the others. The faction points are equally as meaningless since you can simply buy the items if you even want to bother to with how crappy they are.

Semantics doesn't change it one bit.

[Burn]

This even being a conversation shows how fail the leveling system in the game really is. Too bad I don't ever see them removing the focus away from leve leveling to a more real quest based style of leveling that introduces us to the entire game by going to all the diff camps and not just 3-4 camps out of the entire world.

[Molly_Millions]

This even being a conversation shows how fail the leveling system in the game really is. Too bad I don't ever see them removing the focus away from leve leveling to a more real quest based style of leveling that introduces us to the entire game by going to all the diff camps and not just 3-4 camps out of the entire world.

For what it's worth, I plan to search for guild marks at every camp systematically after I hit 50 on all my battle classes. In doing so, I'll inevitably hit all the 'neglected' camps.

[syntaxlies]

It does. No amount of semantics or technicalities changes that. The reward is you get the same best SP giving leves in a row guaranteed. The gil is meaningless because you don't fail every single leve. You make plenty off the others. The faction points are equally as meaningless since you can simply buy the items if you even want to bother to with how crappy they are.

Semantics doesn't change it one bit.

First off i didn't design the game nor the reward system, i dot however play whiten the guidelines. It is not my fault the rewards suck, but Ive never heard of the sp you get from killing mobs as a reward. In your definition of reward grinding would also be frowned upon. Killing the same enemy over and over because of the good sp. Im sure you ranked to 50 killing nothing but marmot's but the the rest of us we play the game the way it was designed and if they take the leves away or change the others i will continue to analyze the game and figure out the best way to get sp. The devs have even said that they don't consider it to break any rules of exploitation so I dont see how you think you have an argument.

[Vackashken]

First off i didn't design the game nor the reward system, i dot however play whiten the guidelines. It is not my fault the rewards suck, but Ive never heard of the sp you get from killing mobs as a reward. In your definition of reward grinding would also be frowned upon. Killing the same enemy over and over because of the good sp. Im sure you ranked to 50 killing nothing but marmot's but the the rest of us we play the game the way it was designed and if they take the leves away or change the others i will continue to analyze the game and figure out the best way to get sp. The devs have even said that they don't consider it to break any rules of exploitation so I dont see how you think you have an argument.

Semantics. Knock it off.

I wish we could send PMs here, but since we can't here goes. (Sorry to everyone else for derailing this thread)

Fair enough, in that case I apologize for calling you a douche in said conversation. As I tried to say in that convo, maybe those people see me as arrogant, but the truth is I' a down to earth guy and am extremely laid back, as anyone in Abaddon can attest to. I am however, a cynic. Don't confuse my cynicism as arrogance, it's only an attempt to get a laugh.

Apology accepted. As I said before it has nothing to do with leve failing why you guys get so much crap. Its the perception of "things" seen as arrogant mentioned before by many people. I don't want to get into it not because of derailing the thread but of not wanting to come across as scolding you or whatnot: in particular in public where anyone would feel the need to save face (which would be understandable).

Ah well, hopefully we can all draw some lines in the sand and not step on each others toes.

[darkstarpoet1]

It does. No amount of semantics or technicalities changes that. The reward is you get the same best SP giving leves in a row guaranteed. The gil is meaningless because you don't fail every single leve. You make plenty off the others. The faction points are equally as meaningless since you can simply buy the items if you even want to bother to with how crappy they are.

Semantics doesn't change it one bit.

ok let me ask something. this is not meant to be a flame or an argument.

player a runes dunes and fails. he gets the sp from every mob he kills, but leaves the last mob so he misses that sp. he abandons the leve and the leve ends. by linking the payer loses a percentage of sp per kill. the overall goes up, but with 4 people they lose over 1 full mob worth of sp over doing it 4 times.

player b runes the leve and completes. he gets the sp from every mob he kills. he kills all mobs and completes the leve. after completing he gets gil, guild rewards, items, and faction credits.

if both player a and player b runs the same leve and both kill the same mobs then the rewards for finishing the leve are the stuff you get at the end. they both got the sp off of each mob they killed. how is one any different than the other as far as sp goes? it's determined that the overall sp does drop by linking over running it 4 times. they were already punished by giving up 120%-160% of the sp for one kill by max links and the rewards that are given at the end.

[Delmontyb]

I feel that one of the issues that causes us to "fail" leves (and while I'm guilty, I still do it so I can get a group when I get online) is the limiting nature that is the guildleve.

People have brought it up before, but I ask, would there be a need to fail a leve if you were guaranteed that leve each and every time? If all leves were opened up at each camp and you could pick and choose, then you wouldn't need to worry about too much coordination between group mates.

(I would vote that there would be more leves at each camp, but that's for another thread)

Then if you could pick any leve you want per reset, then it comes down to the rewards and the amount of sp that is made per leve itself.

If I was able to login and get in a party, I wouldn't worry about focusing on Dunesfolk or the other popular leves, because my party could then decide which leves we want to run... For gear, gil, sp, or what have you. However, being the way the current system is setup I want to grab these leves and fail, so the next time I'm online I am able to get into a party.

Most of the issues that the game is facing come from it's limiting nature by design. Yoshi-P and team are working to correct this, but for the time being this is what we have. Hopefully over the next few patches, more content will be introduced and more things that help us level up will come into play. I wouldn't mind the 36 hour reset, if there were other ways to level besides the traditional party grid (which I'm all for, but the rewards/balance needs to be on par with leves if not slightly under)...

Just think about it, you login to play, you go and grab some leves, and set your LFP flag, and while you wait for a party, you find that there is some battle going down at X location. You head out there, and start helping the company hold back the empire. From here you are auto-teamed up with fellow players and after the battle, you decided to run some leves. Since you already got some, they go pick up the same ones and your off to camp.

Image if you will if you were able to queue up for a dungeon run, or some pvp content, or defend the city... And all of these actions help you level up. If those things existed, a 36 hour leve reset would almost come to fast for the average gamer, but as it sits now if I'm able to play two days in a row I have a blast on day one and spend day two trying to find things to do.

Sorry for the length of this post, I just got on a tangent there.

[Raze]

And.... Molly defends failing leves once again so that leve abandoning can be a reason to hold a 200 person linkshell together. I doubt all the r30s spamming levinshower are really interested in your end game failings. At least you stopped calling people names like "douche".