Bring back zones like:

[Sotek]

Let's say first time you go to Castle Zvahl Bailey was to kill Shadow Lord. There are strong enemies that made you have to sneak/invis around so you couldn't just go anywhere you pleased like in FFXIV. Second time you might explore more of the area looking for coffer keys or hunting nms, quests, or whatever. The areas are big enough that you can still get lost after going to it often.

Now compared that to FFXIV where you explore Satasha. There was just more to FFXI areas like FF12 is to FF13.

When I first went through Zvahl it was fun, though I instantly noticed the heavy amount of copy and paste zone design. Second time I went through it I knew things like the teleport mechanics, and the copy and paste zone design was just boring by then so there was nothing new to see.
First time I went through Satasha? Still had a lot of copy and paste zone design, but it was far more varied than anything in XI. It had an interesting boss who kept running off. It had side passages for optional treasure chests. One of those side passages had two groups of enemies fighting each other, which was very entertaining to see. Other side passages had some caged whores.

Zvahl was the same corridor over and over, occasionally swapping out the type of beastmen I'd already seen plenty of from Lv.1. The Shadow Lord at the end was the only new thing there.
Satasha was varied, had optional side passages with a purpose then and there (and side passage in Zvahl was to be seen later), as well as interesting things happening there. It was the first time in the game I'd faced a Coeurl type mob (which also came as a surprise). It was the first time in the game I'd faced Sahagin.

Best part here? Satasha is the first dungeon in XIV. Zvahl was the endgame on XI at launch. A real comparison would be Zvahl vs Castrum Meridianum and Praetorium. Granted, there is a lot less path deviation there.

[Doo]

When I first went through Zvahl it was fun, though I instantly noticed the heavy amount of copy and paste zone design. Second time I went through it I knew things like the teleport mechanics, and the copy and paste zone design was just boring by then so there was nothing new to see.

Honestly, FFXI maps were so very well designed that I didn't really notice have time to notice the copy/pasta. It was always exciting to revisit areas because they never got dull to the point where you could faceroll it solo.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIcLKaLtdHU

[BloodPact]

Honestly, FFXI maps were so very well designed that I didn't really notice have time to notice the copy/pasta. It was always exciting to revisit areas because they never got dull to the point where you could faceroll it solo.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIcLKaLtdHU

You're just biased, like I was when I was obsessed with that game. Go run from one end of Meriphataud Mountains to the other and tell me those 10 minutes(!!!!!!) it took you to get from one point to the other were exciting. Now, take out Meriphataud Mountains and insert: Jugner Forest, Sanctuary of Zi'tah, Sarutabaruta, Al'Taieu, whatever the area outside Aht Urghan was, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. They were super larger, copy/pastas, that's it. I'm not complaining about it; back when I was playing I loved the game and all those zones, but to say they were better than what we have in this game is just not right.

[Themis]

things

I have to agree. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed playing FFXI, but the maps weren't that well designed. They were big, yes, but big =/= good design. Most of the map wasn't used for anything (more so in the earlier days than later when things like Voidwatch was added).

Running to Jeuno was fun the first time because it was a different kind of adventure, you had no chocobo or invis/sneak to just run through everything, and it was quite tense when that Gobbie you were following stops to turn around. After that, though, it quickly died off. You got a 'Bo and you just ran by everything for 15-20 minutes.

Simply put, the maps were bigger than they needed to be. I actually prefer XIVs map design because most of it actually feels functional or has a different vibe to it. If it was larger, it may not have had that same feeling and that was the purpose behind designing it smaller.

Maybe in the future we will get some bigger maps but every part of it has to have a reason to exist and not just be there for the sake of it.

[Sotek]

Honestly, FFXI maps were so very well designed that I didn't really notice have time to notice the copy/pasta. It was always exciting to revisit areas because they never got dull to the point where you could faceroll it solo.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIcLKaLtdHU

I actually agree. The zones were well designed. The problem is the content around them wasn't, the content utterly wasted the potential the zones had.

As much as I loathed Abyssea, it at least gave me reason to see parts of La Thiene. It really wasn't until Abyssea that XI really made the most of its zones. The majority of NMs in XI were pretty damn pointless, as were the coffers. They justified the large map but they were so utterly worthless. Actually, Wings of the Goddess might have been the start of them using zones properly, SCNMs were utterly great in that regard.

Exploration kinda loses its effect when i can do them as level 1 fisher. There nothing to explore in FFXIV, or i should say no reason to explore... no mysterious ancient technologies like the crags, or hidden corridors in plain zone.

Your mileage may vary.

I very much enjoyed exploring Eorzea at launch. I had no Sneak/Invis to just walk past everything, I actually had to treat every mob in XIV as True Sight mobs in XI. I enjoyed walking through The Shroud and finding Urths Font, traveling to Thanalan and seeing High Bridge, Burning Wall and then Southern Thanalan. I enjoyed finding all the scars of Dalamund scattered throughout the zones. I enjoyed heading to Coerthas and finding towers and camps that actually made sense. Seeing Natalan, exploring the caves nearby, and the ruins just north of it. Seeing Ishgard again. I enjoyed seeing Boulderdowns for the first time, then heading to Mor Dhona, walking out the gate and seeing Crystal Tower.

Again, your milage may vary.

[Doo]

As much as I loathed Abyssea, it at least gave me reason to see parts of La Thiene.

I always help players do AF quests, nation quests, limit break quests, main story quests, expansions quests, hunt nms, xp grinding, farming, bcnms, etc. I found plenty of reasons to going back to areas that I've been to before.

You're just biased,

Aren't we all? The difference is I don't pretend not to be bias.

[Sotek]

I always help players do AF quests, nation quests, limit break quests, main story quests, expansions quests, hunt nms, etc. I found plenty of reasons to going back to areas that I've been to before.

None of those things involved you traveling to certain corners of the maps. The entire south west section of La Thiene, for example. It was wasted space until Abyssea put it to use.

Just compare the use of the map in Davoi to the use in La Vaule (S). The difference is quite apparent.

[Doo]

None of those things involved you traveling to certain corners of the maps. The entire south west section of La Thiene, for example.

There were plenty of places in FF12 I didn't go to but that doesn't mean it should just change into a linear corridor like FF13 though. Players still got lost trying to find quests or got chased by mobs and had to run in different directions.

I'm not arguing that...

Those quests that I mentioned did take you to many different areas all over Vana Diel though. Just take a lot at Rise of Zilart quest to get Sky access as an example. I mean where there still unused areas in FFXI? Sure, but they did a great job of making areas relevant for a long time.

[Sotek]

There were plenty of places in FF12 I didn't go to but that doesn't mean it should just change into a linear corridor like FF13 though.

I'm not arguing that...

Those quests that I mentioned did take you to many different areas all over Vana Diel though. Just take a lot at Rise of Zilart quest to get Sky access as an example.

And still, vast areas of the zones had no purpose... XIV pretty much did the same thing as Sky access though, albeit on a smaller scale. Did I visit the Beastman strongholds while leveling? Nope. Did I visit them for Primal/Crystal Tower access? Yep.

[Synapse]

Your mileage may vary.

Considering i had exploration blog in lodestone, and 1.0 had better scenery than 2.0(which my blog was mainly about)

Yes, Mileage may vary, as an experienced explorer, FFXIV ARR broken down after few days.


Not sure if we can revisit old Lodestone blogs... if its possible and it ifs still there to trace it with my character name(cant now cause at work and lodestoneis blocked :/)

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...f-Eorzea/page6