Confirmation of Uncapped Raids. Confirmation of a terrible decision.

[TheVedis]

LMFAO! Again you are trying to pin on me that I have apparently stated I'm for/against a level cap. I simply say that a difficulty slider is NOT the way (because SE will just replicate the levequest slider). Quote the piece of text where I suggested a level cap would solve the difficulty issue.

...

...Find it?

...

...didn't think so. Doesn't exist.

We need something that encourages strategic play.

strategic play isnt in this conversation, thats the problem

its a bunch of people whining that others may get gear faster then them by using 50s

[AngryNixon]

most people with r30s as their highest dont share the optiniosn of a level cap, thats whats really funny here
they DONT CARE
its the people here with 50s wanting the challenge who want it

That's because at least some R50s want all the content targeted at them, even if it technically isn't they want some means of re-targeting it at themselves so they have something to do. Not that I don't selfishly share that sentiment but I'm not losing sleep over that not being the case because I live in reality (sometimes; not including holidays and weekends).

[Roaran]

I already stated this at the bottom of page 11. If you want a challenge, do the r50 dungeon. The rank 30 dungeon is intended to be something ENTIRELY different. If you really have all your classes r50 and your bummed about not being able to do this as a r30, level another character, you obviously have a lot of free time. I intend to steamroll the r50 dungeon... I think that is a much greater concern.

[TheVedis]

That's because at least some R50s want all the content targeted at them, even if it technically isn't they want some means of re-targeting it at themselves so they have something to do. Not that I don't selfishly share that sentiment but I'm not losing sleep over that not being the case because I live in reality (sometimes; not including holidays and weekends).

and thats what ive been saying the whole time

people in this thread are mad because

1) people may get gear faster then them

2) its an r30 dungeon and not a 2nd r50 dungeon

[darkstarpoet1]

Example u enter the dungeon as ur MRD 50, get some nice r20' gear for your r21 THM, hell of alot easier than getting is a r21 THM isnt it?

example your friend that is a r21 thm that cannot get a group together and asks for help. the dungeon for the r30 you have already completed and want to go help them. you grab your high class and help them. you want to make it to where we have to tell our firends and ls mates to go away because you feel as though you have a single example of why it wouldn't work. there is just as many reasons to leave it uncapped as there is to cap it.

the truth is se decided to leave it uncapped so i will not be following your method.

[DurtiMonkeyToe]

heres the thing i dont get with you and vedis, do you think the game shouldnt be challenging till you are level 50? because thats what you seem to promote.

matsui said
"Reform Concept
Fostering Skillful Play
Creating a battle system that fosters skillful play."

is that a world you want to play in, because yes the fact that people can over level content will effect everyone who does said content. at the very least, it alters the standard/default behavior, in an uncapped system, most people doing the content will be above level, if the gear is best till 36, then everyone up to level 36 will have a real reason to go there, and people who just want the item.
A random party will probably look like
25 30 35 48 in level distribution, in that case the average party will have no difficulty or challenge, the default setting becomes easy mode. very anti battle reform idealogy.

Never once have I said that. What I want is to be challenged at r50. Period. That is all I have ever said. I'm getting that out of the r50 dungeon, but I am not going to run a capped r30 dungeon for gear I don't need.

[AngryNixon]

and thats what ive been saying the whole time

people in this thread are mad because

1) people may get gear faster then them

2) its an r30 dungeon and not a 2nd r50 dungeon

You know it's strange Vedis it almost seems like some people are saying they are incapable of exercising discretion or making good use of their freewill. Like if someone put a loaded gun in front of them they'd pick it up and kill someone because someone put a loaded gun in front of them, so what possible other choice could they have made.

[Perrin_Aybarra]

A r30 dungeon isn't hard for a r50 player, period. If I have to cap my own skills at r30, then it is a cosmetic challenge only.

Exactly the point, why not be in favor for an optional cap for better reward then? If they aren't meant to be a challenge for level 50, why would you allow the same rewards if you steamroll through them with a/some level 50 in your group? It's just more arguments to add a cap, optional or not.

And you know that cosmetic means it just in apparence right? so capping your level 50 at level 30 is not comestic, its game mechanics

[darkstarpoet1]

Exactly the point, why not be in favor for an optional cap for better reward then? If they aren't meant to be a challenge for level 50, why would you allow the same rewards if you steamroll through them with a/some level 50 in your group? It's just more arguments to add a cap, optional or not.

And you know that cosmetic means it just in apparence right? so capping your level 50 at level 30 is not comestic, its game mechanics

you kill a mob and get a drop is the exact same thing as i kill a mob and get a drop.

why should you get a better reward for killing the same mob that i did?

[Shura]

even the consolation prize gear effects the economy, look at mee deggi, and impact knuckles, it was the crappy drop, the fact that people farmed kote all day meant that impact knuckles was cheap as dirt, and that effected the price of everything close to its level, and everything in range that competed.

the fact that it will probably have a cooldown only makes things worse, people hate failure and will try to take thier high friends to make it easier, not only that, but those people will not be in the available pool of people do the quest, so for people who actually want to do it at the reccomended level, they will lose players who would otherwise be available to try to obtain the gear.

Its a bad idea on a lot of levels, of course we dont know everything, we are talking about what has been presented to us, and how things have worked before.
If there are penalties then it is fine, but we are working under the premise there are not since no one has said there are.

I'm pretty sure if they have high lv friends who are willing to waste their time to help, they would do so regardless of lv cap. Its been brought up already but only a small amount of people who are currently playing have all classes higher then 35+ and as far as SE is concerned the Lv25 dungeon is targeted at future players so they have something to do. impact knuckles is a poor example if you think these dungeons will effect the economy the same way impact knuckles did in FFXI. impact knuckles was a crappy item with a high drop rate. While we don't have much information, we do know that these dungeons will drop more then 2 items. Your still assuming drop rate will be so high that all items would drop at a rate that will effect the economy like knuckles did.

As i mentioned in my previous post, there are 7 classes in the game, the dungeons have a 60min time limit, based on previous post by yoshida we know there are multiple routes to take and we still don;t know what the reentry cool down is. Even with high lv help, if reentry is 24-36h, low drop rate, and multiple routes; its gonna make getting these items hard. So i dont understand why ppl care if a group with high lvl clears the area 30mins faster then you, since it in no way effects anyone else.

People have to also remember, capping lvls in this game won't be as simple as it was in FFXI, since in this game, you can lv a class to 50, then equip your lv 50 skill onto one of your lv 10 classes. If they were to do lv cap in this game, they would have to figure out which skills to take away and which players can keep. something like this will be easier to do once the battle changes have happened, its a waste of time to figure out how to cap lv in the current system when they already plan to change the system. I'd rather have them design more dungeons then waste time figuring that out and implementing it.