MT Garuda ex

[MythToken]

All the right things have been said in here, tailor your strat to your group. Solo healz makes this fight insanely easier. Double wicked wheel is easily dealt with if you just watch for friction, or have your OT call it out. Nuff said.

[SpookyGhost]

Ok. I don't know what is wrong with everyone, but popping Sentinel, Hallowed Ground, Vengeance, or Thrill of Battle to eat 2x WW isn't hard. I don't know who decided that this was difficult. They jump, they come back, Friction, you hit the button, you eat the 2x WW. If this is somehow a difficult concept for you, maybe tanking isn't your thing and I don't know how you made it to Garuda EX when Titan HM employs the same concept. Rock Breaker -> Mountain Buster.

Anyway, the best possible strat is to split all 3 to different people. MT on Garuda, OT on Suparna and a melee on Chirada. Everyone (DPS + Heals) splits the Downburst damage, MT and OT take 1 wicked wheel, everything is 100% fine and 100% easier to manage. But only Japan does this because apparently no one else thinks that DPS can take damage and not die.

[SirTaint]

Ok. I don't know what is wrong with everyone, but popping Sentinel, Hallowed Ground, Vengeance, or Thrill of Battle to eat 2x WW isn't hard. I don't know who decided that this was difficult. They jump, they come back, Friction, you hit the button, you eat the 2x WW. If this is somehow a difficult concept for you, maybe tanking isn't your thing and I don't know how you made it to Garuda EX when Titan HM employs the same concept. Rock Breaker -> Mountain Buster.

Anyway, the best possible strat is to split all 3 to different people. MT on Garuda, OT on Suparna and a melee on Chirada. Everyone (DPS + Heals) splits the Downburst damage, MT and OT take 1 wicked wheel, everything is 100% fine and 100% easier to manage. But only Japan does this because apparently no one else thinks that DPS can take damage and not die.

And killing Chirada is pointless and prolongs the fight

[MythToken]

And killing Chirada is pointless and prolongs the fight

Please delete your post for not being relevant.

[Gamemako]

Well, shit, I just accidentally cleared my response. Basically, OP, l2p. Eating double WW is easy and predictable (hint: pop CDs at the end of Garuda's slipstream), dodging is pointless and risky, and a bunch of people got blinders attached to their noggins due to i90 static groups overgearing and winning anyway. Those people should just do the Suparna-only farm method.

Suparna to OT is good with all ranged DPS. Otherwise, unnecessary risk in addition to reduced DPS. Split method (aka triangle method) has a lot of moving parts and fails 100% of the time in pugs. MT on double WW method is not difficult; it's just rote. Hard part is OT wrangling with DPS and healers.

[leprov]

Wow....Did any of you read original post?
Yeah, casting a cd just after friction is easy. Yeah, with an optimal composition, the fight isn't hard. That's not my question.
The problem is about pug groups. They apply the strat that isn't hard for a good group, but is the most risky according to the fact that you don't know with who you are.
In pugs, it's often that :
- your offtank messes the pull on his add, and so is long to place the add, or : the WW happens before the jump.
- your dps are low : the WW happens before the jump
- your group is perfect : the WW happens after the jump.


So you can't just tell "double WW is shortly after friction" if you are in pug. It's either "shortly after friction if your dps is bad (or OT made dps bad), or shortly after jump if your group is fine". It's not a real risk in a static group, but in pug, you can easily wipe cause of this. So if you can minimize this risk in pug : what don't I do right? So if I understood well, rampart+foresight just after friction makes both buffs up even if garuda+suparna jump, and cd come back for every phase?

[Traek]

If you have all ranged, MT takes Suparna, OT takes Chirada. All kill Suparna first, then Chirada. ez pz. I don't know why groups always kill OT's first. Killing Suparna first removes the jump, x2 Wicked Wheel (less stress on heals + tank), and Chirada hits like a pillow with everything but downburst. I usually front load my CDs on Chirada if I OT like this (Vengeance + IB for downburst, IB is up for next one anyways) so heals can snooze through till Suparna dies. The OT can also pick up the Spiny Plume every fight this way, so there is no confusion and a consistent run.

If you got a melee just 3 ranged Suparna, 1 melee Chirada.

[Gamemako]

Wow....Did any of you read original post?

Yes, and I created a much more complete debunking before accidentally clearing it. If you are having trouble with hitting double WW with jump, it is your fault. It is not the game, is not the strategy, it is you. Additionally, PUG groups with melee DPS will fail reliably if you take Suparna because somewhere in the 3-5 times you cycle around, a melee will screw up and you will wipe. Better still, if you are struggling with DPS, there's no way you're going to turn a fail into a win by using a strategy that, in the absolute best case, decreases your DPS.

So you can't just tell "double WW is shortly after friction" if you are in pug.

Actually, you can. The jump doesn't take up 8 minutes. I never, ever miss Vengeance on double WW -- only thing I ever do miss is Inner Beast, which I cap with another Infuriate->IB. The fight is entirely scripted. In the first sister phase, it's after Suparna's Downburst, which comes after Garuda's Friction. In the tornado phase, it's Chirada's downburst, which comes after Garuda's Slipstream. When Garuda uses her Slipstream, move to dodge and hit Rampart/ToB. When it finishes, move back and hit Foresight/Vengeance at next action.

If you have all ranged, MT takes Suparna, OT takes Chirada. All kill Suparna first, then Chirada. ez pz. I don't know why groups always kill OT's first... The OT can also pick up the Spiny Plume every fight this way, so there is no confusion and a consistent run... If you got a melee just 3 ranged Suparna, 1 melee Chirada.

If you have a melee, well, you answered your own question. Unless you're dramatically overgeared, the spiny swap has to happen while both sisters are alive, which is dangerous to everyone involved and gives both targets 50-70% damage reduction for the duration. You also enjoy longest duration of buff times for everything. Worst-case, you also get hit with two double wicked wheels for your effort. No real advantage to trying it that way unless you're geared to the hilt.

If you're all ranged, then it really doesn't matter. You can ignore Chirada altogether and blast Garuda in 4-5 minutes with all ranged.

[Kuwagami]

snip

from my experience, you can predict wether suparna will WW without friction, when she derps with Slipstream, she will usually use WW before friction.

Usually, what I see is :
1) garuda uses Slipstream right away, immediatly followed by suparna. get ready for friction and pop a CD right after it. I also move to next tornado angle asap to avoid pre-wrap WW.

2) Suparna somehow doesn't use Slipstream before tornadoes come. You'll get WWed before friction comes. Pop a CD after 3-4 secs and pray for your healer to be on top level, it will hurt. running away after garuda's friction helps also.

3) if they wrap, you can avoid all damage more or less by going in an other angle, coming back, then CD and re go to an other corner. You'll get only Garuda's WW at max

[Traek]

If you have a melee, well, you answered your own question. Unless you're dramatically overgeared, the spiny swap has to happen while both sisters are alive, which is dangerous to everyone involved and gives both targets 50-70% damage reduction for the duration. You also enjoy longest duration of buff times for everything. Worst-case, you also get hit with two double wicked wheels for your effort. No real advantage to trying it that way unless you're geared to the hilt.

If you're all ranged, then it really doesn't matter. You can ignore Chirada altogether and blast Garuda in 4-5 minutes with all ranged.

The point was if you are all ranged (on my server its often shot for) they *SHOULD* be killing the MT's add first. There is no reason to kill the OT's first with all ranged. You are removing the chance of MT getting roflpwned by x2 wicked wheel as soon as Suparna is dead. As much as we like to portray what happens in our statics or perfect scenario, I am pretty sure we have all seen our very hard faceplants in pugs.

As far as 3 ranged 1 melee, if your ranged is at the appropriate dps then the swap scenario (reduced damage) doesn't happen. Obviously that isn't the case often times, so I agree. In that case their DD wouldn't be good enough to down Chirada before provoke was ready again for Suparna, so you could easily taunt spiny at start as OT, then taunt Suparna across for melee as ranged kill and MT grabs spiny off you. There really is too many ways to do this fight successfully.

I am of course talking downing both sisters, the method of ignoring Chirada and burning Suparna/Garuda is a valid one if agreed upon, its still not a standard yet. I haven't even seen one pug group suggest it.