Does tanking carry more responsibility than most?

[Revya]

I agree with jetaisnoobie, it really is an easy to master class. you just need to always be open minded and take those "you suck cause you didnt do it this way" remarks as a chance to grow. never hurts to try something new out.

This might be the most common thing why people don't like to tank. As they are often more open to bad comments then most, as they are standing in front of everyone.

im still getting people that have never seen a tank do the best tanking method in copperbell mines HM and they applaud me for telling them and teaching them how to do it.

Now this got me interrested. What is the best way to tank copperbell mines HM??

it takes a calm headed person to be a great tank. thinking clearly in those stressful situations is the best thing you can do.

I think this is the greatest asset you can have as a Tank class. Calm minded in the most stressful situations.

Now as for the original post... I love tanking and i love Healing. I find them both challenging and fun to master. But the reason many don't want to do this job is simply because they are often just unsure of them self and a little afraid to try.

So encouraging FC members and your common stranger during you Daily Roulette does go along way to help new tank's to emerge.

[Synestra]

Now this got me interrested. What is the best way to tank copperbell mines HM??

Likevise, assuming we are talking lastboss only good places where to tank him is either middle or next to add spawn location. Middle makes it easier to healer to heal i guess but tanking near add spawn reduces party DMG when you can stun those adds, only done that place 2-3 times so dont really know any nifty tricks in there.

What comes to tanking itself i find it pretty easy thing to do in this game compared for tanking TERA, only classes that i would give "hard to master" title is SCH and MNK when pumping maximum performance out of those classes. Sure tanks has some small tricks in their sleeves when it comes to playing full potential but those wont take long to grasp.

[granz]

I think tanking is a hard job, they carry the burden of the whole party. A good tank would not just tank, but find new strategies to win the fight. A good tank is never an idle tank, meaning they will always have something to do, like casting stone skin on healers, etc. The Tank job, mainly paladin, is more than just a meat shield.

When you've played with a good tank, you realize how inefficient a bad one is. The main problem why i think there isn't many tanks, is because most people stomp out learning tanks, and lump them with bad tanks.

[inkuzen]

I agree with granz and ashwich. Tanking isn't hard, there's just a lot of responsibilities that have lumped in with tanking. People taking on tanking for the first time won't know what is expected of them. Especially first time MMO players, which would be the learning tanks. After a few parties of angry party members I can see a learning tank just be like "Well F**K THAT!" Because they had no idea what was actually going wrong. I kind of feel like there should be tank coaching for noobs :P While there are many tutorials and compendiums on the forums, some players just don't come here.

[SquireZed]

I feel like the tank subtly assumes a sort of party leader role, because they function as the impetus for action in a group. They are responsible for pulling enemies, keeping all the party members alive by taking damage away from the squishier people and dumping it all on themselves (as opposed to the healer, which in a functional party only needs to worry about the tank and AoE, with some exceptions), and also need to understand and control the field. A bad tank can ruin a party in a way that almost no other role can, while a good tank is a necessity for more difficult missions, even if the tank is simply a DPS performing the duties of the tank in a fight (if in a party with no dedicated tank). For example, if a tank disconnects, a Lancer may take over and keep enmity away from the healers. These roles are vital to keeping the party moving forward.

The hard part of tanking is that you get blamed when anything goes wrong. "X pulled enmity? Tank must suck. DPS died in fight? Tank must suck. Someone ate a red box for breakfast? Tank must suck."

[Senfei]

as a PLD main, I'll put it this way. I think it is much easier to be a "good" tank than it is to be a "good" dps. (never healed, sorry you fools don't get included =P )

What I mean is, if you are a halfway decent tank then you are forced to pay attention to many different things. You are watching emnity, you are watching your party members, you are watching enemy positioning and any nearby enemy patrols. You are controlling the battle, so you are forced to pay attention. If you aren't doing those things, well, you probably aren't a halfwar decent tank.

[SquireZed]

What I mean is, if you are a halfway decent tank then you are forced to pay attention to many different things. You are watching emnity, you are watching your party members, you are watching enemy positioning and any nearby enemy patrols. You are controlling the battle, so you are forced to pay attention. If you aren't doing those things, well, you probably aren't a halfwar decent tank.

The problem is that there are a great deal of tanks that *DON'T* pay attention and don't control the field, and as a result make the rest of us tanks look realllllly bad. The importance of a good tank can be seen in parties where the tank fundamentally fails and everything hits the fan.

[Ooshima]

The problem is that there are a great deal of tanks that *DON'T* pay attention and don't control the field, and as a result make the rest of us tanks look realllllly bad. The importance of a good tank can be seen in parties where the tank fundamentally fails and everything hits the fan.

Actually, it's party due to game design on party composition. Example - Titan HM. Does it really need 2 tanks? Nope. If you understood the fight (and of course, decently geared) then it's obvious that there is no tank swap or other mechanics that forces you to use 2 tanks. But if you DF it, you will need 2 tanks. Why? IDK, that's probably for Yoshida to explain. Maybe just in case the MT is a flop and dies, the OT can pick up the boss. It allows you to have 2 ok-ok tanks and swap each other in case one dies, but in actual fact, if you have one good tank it's good enough. In this case, there isn't really a stress on the need to have a good tank.


But if it's a 4 man dungeon like Pharos Sirus, then yes your tank needs to be at least decent. Why? Because it's a 4 man, Tank-DPS-DPS-Healer composition. If your tank dies, there is no tank at all, and of course a wipe will occur.

Again, let's look at party compositions again, and back to Titan HM as example. We talked about how it actually can be done with 1 good tank. It can also be done with 1 good WHM, provided that DPS are not eating damage other than tulmults and your tanks aren't dying. But DF forces you to have 2 healers, just in case your DPS/tanks are a flop and dying. Then we look at DPS. 4 of them? Can it be done with 3 DPS? It can be done. I'm not talking about wearing full i90 sets and carrying - back then in 2.0 there are already people selling HM runs in DL gear. There is a video out there showing Titan HM done with 1 tank, 2 DPS and 1 healer (albeit I believe they are overgearred). What does this say? You don't really need 4 DPS for this battle either. If you have 3 good DPS that can squeeze out every DPS he/she can throw out, it's good enough. But the game says 4 DPS just in case some DPS dies or the 4 DPS are just ok-ok only.

And for the fact that the system is structured in a way that only Tank classes are able to absorb boss's onslaughts, only Healers can heal as required, only DPS classes can deal decent damage, there is no other choice. Tanks responsibilities is to ensure that they know their job and use CDs correctly. DPS's job is to make sure that they don't eat unnecessary damage and be a burden to the team while killing the mobs/boss ASAP (because the longer you drag, the more room for mistakes for everyone). Healer's job is to make sure everyone is topped up. It doesn't mean anyone is above another in responsibility and importance.

If once day there are changes to this system, such as introducing hybrid classes, then people may think differently. Example, Blue Mages that can cast offensive and healing magics at 80% efficiency of their specialized counterparts, Black/White Mages can do. Maybe a Beastmaster that have abilities of a Warrior class at a lower efficiency/potency but at the same time, have the potency say 80% of a melee DPS class.

When this happen, even if in a 4 man dungeon, will I care a deal if a PLD/WAR dies? Maybe not as much, the Beastmaster can take over until the healer raise the PLD/WAR. Is it all lost if the sole healer dies? Maybe not, since I have a Blue Mage. But we don't have mixed classes now, so it is important that everyone understands and does their job well to make everyone's life easier.

[givemeraptors]

Okay but let's expand upon your logic...

In a 4 man group... tank is 25% of the party, DPS is 25% of the party, and healer is 25% of the party... but there's 2 people doing DPS... so each DPS is only 12.5%, or half of a person. And sometimes you think they've got 1 brain to split between them, to boot.

What the heck kind of math are you doing? DPS is 50% of the party...

A bad tank can ruin a party in a way that almost no other role can, while a good tank is a necessity for more difficult missions, even if the tank is simply a DPS performing the duties of the tank in a fight (if in a party with no dedicated tank). For example, if a tank disconnects, a Lancer may take over and keep enmity away from the healers. These roles are vital to keeping the party moving forward.

Every role can ruin the party in unique ways. When I role tank I KNOW when we're not doing good DPS. I KNOW when the healer isn't doing their job (or even doing it well and DPSing at the same time). That there are people who roll tanks here and claim ignorance of the equal importance all roles play is just terrible. I honestly don't think you're a very good tank if you don't notice these things.

Not calling you out specifically btw SquireZed, just saying in general.

[borderlander]

i am new to this sort games i am a tank and learning but if you lose 5sec aggro everybody gets mad and thats wy there are almost no tanks